Author Topic: Snapdragon 26  (Read 27758 times)

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Offline Jim_ME

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Snapdragon 26
« on: November 30, 2010, 08:28:32 PM »
Thought that I would start this to discuss the Thames Snapdragon 26 sailboats... so that I won't clutter up your Great Loop Cruise thread, Bruce.

Offline Snapdragon

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Re: Snapdragon 26
« Reply #1 on: December 01, 2010, 05:09:55 PM »
Thanks Jim. Jake asked me to get the hull number of my snappy from the brass plate inside of the port side cockpit locker so that we could research the history of our respective boats.  It was impossible for me to reach the boat today due to high winds and waves, but I hope to be able to get to it tomorrow.  What do you know about the history of your snappy? 
The big boat always has the right of way!
"Puff"
1970 Thames Snapdragon 26, twin keel

Offline Jim_ME

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Re: Snapdragon 26
« Reply #2 on: December 01, 2010, 09:47:04 PM »
Bruce, Jake asked me what my hull number was, too. I've replied that I don't know, and had not come across any builder's plate yet, and was going to ask where it might be--if there is one. So you have anticipated that question. It's pouring rain out right now, but I may be able to check tomorrow, in the daylight.

I know very little about the history of my boat. The ad that I saw called it a Centaur, but I could see that it was a Snapdragon. The PO thought that he had a set of sails, but could not find them, so I could not look for the sail number on the main. I did however, get the boom, but judging its length by how far it extends beyond the 8-foot pickup bed, it appears to only be about 10 feet long, and I believe that the E dimension that I saw on a specs page is about 11.4 feet, so I'm having some doubts about whether it is the correct boom or not. If it is convenient for you sometime, perhaps you would measure your boom length for me to compare with?

On that rig specs page, the snapdragon had somewhat similar P & E [or at least E dim, since I've checked, below] rig dims as the Alberg Sea Sprite 23--which I have a mainsail for. So I'm hoping that I can use it on the Snapdragon.  

For some reason the tabernacle mast base is still bolted to the mast, and not the cabin trunk. I don't know why...maybe the bolts were corroded and broke, or the PO wanted to re-bed the base?

I will have to keep a lookout for a reasonable trailer like yours with the low crossmembers that the keels can sit on. Yours appears to sit nearly a foot lower than mine, and that may translate into 8 or 10 feet less tongue length/ramp distance. Towing the boat felt heavier than expected, but much of that is the weight of this big trailer--another reason to find a smaller/lighter one. One dream is to eventually tow one of my sailboats down South in winter and to extend the all-too-short local sailing season. After towing this one 50 miles, even with the 1-ton dually diesel, I've got some serious reservations about towing it long distance with this trailer.

One thought that I had was that I might find someone who would let me park a sailboat/trailer in his yard over the summer, and I could trade and let him/her park a boat/trailer in my yard over the winter. When one doesn't have that much money invested in the boat, it seems like using it for only a month or two (or three or four) and to be able to drive South in any vehicle (not a heavy tow vehicle--or fly, take the train, or rideshare...), it would pay for itself in saved fuel cost, possibly in one season. Of course I could store it in a boatyard, as most do, but that gets into much more expense than my shoestring approach...

Then there is arranging one's life so that you can take a month or three and go South--saving up that cruising kitty and taking time off or closing your freelance business, or something. I met a fellow that works in a boatyard here in Maine in the Summer/Fall and then works in a yard in Florida during the winter. This seems like an ideal arrangement in that you are in each location during its seasonal busy season.

Well...now I have strayed off the Snapdragon topic already and into a more general one...one that may have already been discussed in an existing thread...    

 
BOAT                     I        J        P      E
SNAPDRAGON 26    30.0   9.5     25.0   11.4    
SEA SPRITE 23      25.0   7.8     27.0   11.2

[from http://www.mauriprosailing.com/techinfo/boatspecs/Rig%20S.htm]
« Last Edit: December 01, 2010, 09:59:09 PM by Jim_ME »

Offline Snapdragon

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Re: Snapdragon 26
« Reply #3 on: December 01, 2010, 10:37:50 PM »
Jim, finding the builders plate requires a bit of effort, but at 65 years and 200 pounds even I can fit into the port side cockpit locker in a seated position, facing forward, and see it almost at eye level attached to the inner hull.  Of course I need a flashlight to see it and perhaps several assistants to extract me afterwards.  It's worth the trip though - it's a wonderful way to get to really know your boat.

I'll try to remember to measure the boom on Puff tomorrow and let you know what I find.  An Englishman friend of mine, a knowledgeable chap, told me that my boom was a roller furler type that uses a small crank handle to roll up the main sail.  Of course internal corrosion has seized it so that I can't get it to turn.  I've installed a "Dutchman" flaking system on the main sail and that seems to work just fine.

You are one step ahead of me with the tabernacle base issue.  In checking the bolts on mine I found that the nuts are badly rusted on the throughbolts and the bolt heads will have to be ground off and driven through to remove them.  The bolts seem to be tight now, and strong enough to last for at least another year, so I'll put off removing them until I complete the Great Loop.
The big boat always has the right of way!
"Puff"
1970 Thames Snapdragon 26, twin keel

Offline Snapdragon

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Re: Snapdragon 26
« Reply #4 on: December 02, 2010, 08:35:05 PM »
OK guys, it's official.  The hull number on Puff is  SD26 192.  The boom measures 142 inches from the gooseneck attachment point to the end cap at the aft end of the boom.  Hope this helps.

The big boat always has the right of way!
"Puff"
1970 Thames Snapdragon 26, twin keel

Offline Jim_ME

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Re: Snapdragon 26
« Reply #5 on: December 02, 2010, 09:23:33 PM »
Bruce, Thanks for the boom length measurement. My boom is 121", so maybe I got the high performance high aspect rig with a shorter boom?  ;)
 
My boat is SD26-130. Thanks to you and Jake for telling me where to find the builder's hull number plate.

I've never found those roller reefing booms to work very well (slow, give poor sail shape, boom end droops down with deeper reefs) , and like the traditional reefing points, especially with the Jiffy Reefing setup.

I'm still wondering about the tabernacle mast base on the mast. The PO had no sailboat experience and may have just decided that this was the best way to disconnect and unstep the mast? Now I am thinking that I should measure the mast and see if it is the right one.

It's 27 degrees out there, tomorrows high is forecast to be 40 and then four days with snow ahead. Wish I was down there doing the Mini Loop...Ft Myers to Stuart to Key West...  :D   

Offline Jim_ME

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Re: Snapdragon 26
« Reply #6 on: December 02, 2010, 09:41:48 PM »
In case you haven't found it yet, here's the link to...

Topic: Twin Keels Good or Bad?
http://sailfar.net/forum/index.php/topic,1261.0.html

I'm going to have to read the whole thread to find out the answer...  ;)

« Last Edit: December 02, 2010, 09:59:35 PM by Jim_ME »

Offline jakeindenver

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Re: Snapdragon 26
« Reply #7 on: December 08, 2010, 08:45:39 PM »
Hey Guys... we've got a forum for Snappy's here in the states?  Sounds like a great idea.  It's interesting what your plates look like.  Mine is on the hull side of the port locker but is all numbers and one line.  I heard from Mike Shapard who is the technical director for the Snapdragon & Mirage Association over in England, that some of these were sold as partial kits so mine might have been finished outside of the factory.  Which might account for the difference in the serial plate. 

As I'm rigging my boat to hopefully compete in the Single Handed TransPac in 2012, I'm re-rigging my boat right now and have found some other differences from the factory specs.  I'd be very greatful if you two guys wouldn't mind taking a few "close up" pictures of your masthead assembly showing how the halyards run down and weather they're internal or external.  Mine is external with only one halyard running up and over.  The jib halyard runs through a block hanging on a tang just below the masthead.  I hear from some that they're masthead has a double path for both halyards running up and over the mast.  Please tell me and if possible show me how your rigs are set up.   

I have acquired the original sales brochure which is pretty cool to read.  If you're interested, send me a private message with your email and I'll email you a .pdf of it.  Thought you might be interested.

Here's the link to the Association.  I've joined and have found the help from Mr. Shepard very usefull besides he's a very nice guy and you can call him on Skype which works just great.
http://www.snapdragonmirage.org.uk/


Very cool to see this forum starting up and hope others join as well.  I'm linking this link to some forums overseas so some more Snappy's might join the fun.

Thanks,

jake

Offline Jim_ME

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Re: Snapdragon 26
« Reply #8 on: December 14, 2010, 11:17:14 PM »
My first thought was to create a thread where we could talk about our boats separate from Bruce's cruise blog...and saw that there were other existing threads for specific boats, so why not one for the Snapdragon. I did wonder whether it would be best to title it specifically for Snapdragons, or about twin keel boats in general... I'm also a fan of the Westerly and Hurley boats.

I found this video of a Westerly Warwick sailing hard on the wind in a strong breeze,  with an interesting shot of the windward keel near the surface.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UySEGWaOKXk&feature=related

Jake, Here's one photo that I took from the ground (in the rain) of the masthead and it shows the external jib halyard block.

That's an ambitious goal, to be in the Transpac race. Glad to hear that you have had a good experience with the Snapdragon Association.

-Jim  
« Last Edit: December 14, 2010, 11:19:00 PM by Jim_ME »

Offline jakeindenver

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Re: Snapdragon 26
« Reply #9 on: December 15, 2010, 09:48:35 PM »
Thanks Jim!

Looks like you've got the identical masthead as I do.

So it looks like I must have the original mast. 

Hey, I just received notice that the Snapdraon / Mirage Association just launched a new website in England with a forum so that will helpful as most of the Snappies are over on that side of the pond.

Here's the link to the new website: http://www.snapdragonmirage.org.uk/

They've linked their site to our new here too.  Hopefully between the two we'll get a health discussion about these little monsters!

Take care,

jake

Offline Freedom 91

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Re: Snapdragon 26
« Reply #10 on: December 17, 2010, 04:08:45 PM »
Hi
I have  just joined your forum. I sail a Snapdragon 26 on the east coast of England. Here is  a link to a video of  a trip down the coast ( sorry about the  shakey film)
 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iMltxP_Aj_0
 
Nick
« Last Edit: December 17, 2010, 04:11:04 PM by Freedom 91 »

Offline jakeindenver

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Re: Snapdragon 26
« Reply #11 on: December 17, 2010, 09:30:56 PM »
Welcome Nick.  I love the video.  Looks like you've got a beautiful Snapdragon.  I'd love to speak with you if you don't mind perhaps sending me a message with your phone number I could skype you.  I have some rigging questions that I think you can answer.

Thanks,

Jake in Denver

Offline Jim_ME

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Re: Snapdragon 26
« Reply #12 on: December 18, 2010, 07:28:57 PM »
Nick, Let me join in welcoming you aboard.

I'm impressed with how fast your boat is--7 knots on a close reach--especially for a hefty twin-keel boat. That is quite a suit of sails, and compact dodger.

Enjoyed the video, and hope that you will make and post more. Grog to you.

Jake, Glad that the photo of the masthead was helpful. That's amusing to think of these boats as little monsters...   A Sea Monster does seem tougher than a variety of wildflowers. ;)

-Jim

« Last Edit: December 18, 2010, 09:15:30 PM by Jim_ME »

Offline Freedom 91

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Re: Snapdragon 26
« Reply #13 on: December 20, 2010, 05:52:17 AM »
Hi Jim

Thanks for the welcome. I have to admit though that the boat speed on the video is helped by nearly two knots of tide. Will post another short clip of the trip down the day before, was making over five knots against the tide that day so was impressed.

Nick

Offline Freedom 91

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Re: Snapdragon 26
« Reply #14 on: December 20, 2010, 12:56:11 PM »
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tQK-9fBWnHA

Link to another shaky video clip of my SD26. Sorry I am no camera man.....

Offline shellback

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Re: Snapdragon 26
« Reply #15 on: December 22, 2010, 05:22:02 PM »
Hello!

I just joined the site and it's great to see that other SD26s actually exist.  My wife and I have owned and sailed ours for the past 3 summers here on Lake Michigan.

Before I forget, I see that Jim was asking about the outside width of the keels.  According to some documentation I recently found, the dimension is 5' - 2".  Inside is 4' - 8", and they're 5' -6" long.

Hope this helps.  I've still got some of the original brochures etc. that came with the boat 3 owners ago.

We plan to do some weeks of cruising up the Lake this summer and hopefully beyond.  I interested also in setting up the boat for mechanical self-steering.  It already can sail intself on some angles with the tiller tied down.

Happy to be a member of the group.  Merry Christmas and Happy New Yr.    :)

Ken in Milwaukee

s/v Hermitage  Snapdragon 26  ( I'll be looking for that hull number now )

Offline Jim_ME

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Re: Snapdragon 26
« Reply #16 on: December 22, 2010, 11:33:32 PM »
Hello Ken, I look forward to hearing about how your SD26 was to sail on the big lakes, and feel free to post any photos. Here's a grog to you, to get you started.

Thank you for the keel dimensions. I was setting up a trailer to haul my SD26 out, but did not know the keel width dimension, and could only find a drawing with the plan view and profile (side view of the keel). I scaled a photo and got about 5 feet, and then Bruce measured his at 5 feet. So I extended the keel pad boards inward, and did haul the boat out several weeks ago.

Mine is a project. My total SD26 experience consists of motoring a few miles and hauling out. I can confirm that she does float. Wish that I had a space to work on a boat inside, so the winter wasn't such a long hibernation from sailing/working on the boat.

Nick, Enjoyed your most recent video. It is the first time that I've seen a mainsail  covers the boom like that, (or the blue color). Looks like you are sail/hull #91? Is your boat equipped with an inboard, or an outboard in a well?

I'm interested to hear about how the SD26s do in rough weather/sea conditions from those who have experienced them.

-Jim 

 

Offline Freedom 91

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Re: Snapdragon 26
« Reply #17 on: December 23, 2010, 12:38:39 AM »
Jim, the blue canvas along the boom is a zip up sail bag, with the lazy jack line system I can simply drop the main sail, it falls into the bag and can be zipped up. I will try to post a picture (not sure how yet).
Yes my hull no is 91 however I have yet to find a plate on the hull.
Freedom is equipped with an inboard 10hp Yanma diesel engine.
Seems to handle rough weather well, I think due to its weight.
Hi Shellback, I use a simrad tiller pilot, with the gps, it works well but does use a fair bit of power, great when motoring.

Offline Freedom 91

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« Last Edit: December 23, 2010, 07:34:16 AM by Freedom 91 »

Offline shellback

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Re: Snapdragon 26
« Reply #19 on: December 24, 2010, 02:44:02 PM »
Jim, Thanks for the welcome.

My SD 26 is the driest boat I've ever sailed for her size.  She's very stiff, and I've sailed in winds up to the lower 30 kt. range with reefed main and working jib quite comfortably.  I've been in lighter winds with up to 6 ft. waves with barely a splash on deck anywhere.  She doesn't sail as close to the wind as deeper keeled boats, but I don't mind the trade off of being able to sail where others dare not.  What I  like most is that she's really easy to sail singlehanded.
Nick, thanks for sharing your beautifully fitted boat with us.  I think it's great.  You've already given me a lot of ideas.  If you don't mind I'll have a ton of questions to ask.

Ken