just as it says I like the pacific seacraft and the southern crosses are there any othere boat names you all can tell me to check out that look like these that are kinda shaped like a bathtub I guess they call it. I really like these boats
Thanks
Chris
The Halman 27ft is a nice, roomy dble ender.Their 20fter is definately a 'bath tub' dble ender of 20ft. Both fit the 'small boat-long distance' type.Good 27's go in the $15,000- $22,000 range, the 20fters $5000-$8000
What is that book, about 25% Albergs....not bad huh!!! TJ
seems like all the books I have talk alot about albergs but when they talk about some of the bad things about deck rot is what really scares me but seriously when I buy a boat I hope I can find something I really like around me god I don't want to deal with shipping a boat but I may have to
Thanks
Chris
cored decks are something you gotta watch out for on pretty much any boat over a certain age. so don't let it scare you, just learn to spot the issues. There are some boats that don't have cored decks like the contessa 32 (one just sold on ebay today for 20,000!!!) but the majority of them are cored.
Cored decks are actually a good thing, they provide stiffness and strenght. They just need to be maintained correctly and all hardware should be bedded in properly.
As for other boats.
My personal favorite is the Baba 30 (too expensive for me though)
next on my list would be
Liberty 28
Westsail 28
(the southern cross 28 is my first choice of any boat at the moment,
next on my list are the alberg's [Alberg 30, Cape dory 28-32] then a Herreshoff [bristol 29.9] and a few Luder's [Cheoy Lee Luders 30 or Offshore28 and then the big Allied Luders 33] There are plenty of others I love like the contessa 32 as well, my list is getting HUGE!)
Back to your list :)
there is the expensive ones -
Pretty Much Any Bill Crealock or
any Bob Perry design
(Search yachtworld for those names)
There are some others like the Prairie 32, Mariner 31
(both very heavy like the Westsail 32)
and the Aries 32 (I like these alot-hard to find)
You also might like the Bayfield 29 or 32
There are others too, names escape me atm,
alot of them are Very expensive, most of the crealocks and perry's are
top-of-line cruising boats and sell in the $100,000 range.
Make sure when searching yachtworld, use the advanced search option, for any search, I find that it reveals alot more listings no matter what your search criteria is.
Chris...An 'Alberg' does not imply deck rot ;) He only designs em. He was very conservative in his designs and drew tradition looking boats with great seakeeping qualities.He was also very stubborn and would not give in to requests of increased beam and headroom at the cost of what he felt a boat should be. As to deck rot....there are an EXTREME few boats without deck coreing.Most great designs in fiberglass (IMHO) were brought out in the 60's and early 70's.Most had balsa core decks.It an owner did not re-bed anything bolted through the deck every 5-7yrs you can bet sooner or later water got in.That being said...the vast majority of affordable boats built today STILL use balsa.Deck rot is more a sign of age and improper owner maintainance...nothing to do with the designer.'deck rot' will/is showing up on many boats of the 1980's and newer as well.As to the older Alberg's...at least the design was right and most have heavily built hulls in comparison to todays standards. edit :o ...YES CJ..the old Rhodes designs are just as good with a sweeter sheerline
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
Happens I'm working on an old Pearson Vanguard for a customer, doing some rigging and sail handling upgrades.
Beautiful vessel- 32 feet- Guess who designed her? Would it help if I told you the Vanguard looked JUST like a larger Tehani?
Laura looked at a picture I took and says- "That may be a Pearson, but Alberg didn't draw it- THAT's a Rhodes design!!!
;D ;D ;D
Thanks guys and yes the Baba 30 I do love to I forgot about that one. I'll look up some of those names you have said dnice. I don't know what to say I guess I'm a young old schooler I just like the way the southern cross type of boats look rather then like a beneteau or islander now they may not be that fast but god I just like the lines of them they look like there stable boats. Thanks guys.
Chris
Dnice I looked up all the boats you have told me man what do I do?? I love them all the westsail the aries the bayfield heck oneday I'll be taking a trip either to FL or MD for a week walking onto everyone of these boats dam I like them all will be hard to tell which one will be for me but I'm sure I'll know it when I find the one.
I've set a price tag of nothing over 35000 I'm sure I'll be putting alot more back in it to build it up to where I want it. I should be able to find a nice boat for hopfully under that.
Chris
Might want to look at the list that James Baldwin just published on his website (http://atomvoyages.com/articles/boatlist.htm).
Thanks I usuallly go back to check his site he must have just posted that. I'm opretty much set on a boat that is 30-34ft now no bigger no smaller but will look up those names though still
Thanks
Chris
do you all know a website for the bayfield I'd like to read more of the history about the boat and I can't seem to find it?? Thanks
Chris
The boats were designed by Ted Gozzard,built in a small town just south of Bayfield Ontario (lake Huron)...Clinton or Exeter by failing memory.The company was owned by Ted and Jake.I was in their factory 7-8 times. Jake was (is) a colourful guy, bearded and an exellent sailor.While they are full keel boats I'm not sure that the smaller ones are 'offshore' designs..being more of a cruiser than a passage maker.Their 25 was really a 23 with a molded in bow sprit, yet it had standing headroom, an enclosed head and was very roomy for its length.I alway felt it looked like a 'duck' on the water.It was really not until their 40fter that they got graceful looking.The plant closed in the late 80's.Ted is still building unique boats.Jake ..last I saw him was still messing about boats.
I'm putting a new interior into a Bayfield 23 for a customer right now. Nice coastal cruiser. I don't know that I'd consider it a "blue water" boat though. Others might.
Keys, Bahamas, sure. Be a great boat for that
Across the pond- I dunno :D
yeah after posting my question lastnight I looked at more bayfield 32's on yachtworld and they look very narrow probally to narrow to cross the pound with.looking just now at island packet which can't afford and the pacific seacraft I may barely afford when the time comes but the southern cross maybe the only one I'll be able to afford when the time comes. Now the southern cross being that bathtub look and all what is this kinda Hull called?? so maybe I can just type the name into yachtworld and fine more sailboats like the southern cross. I know yachtworld use to have alot more boats but now when I type in for sailboats not much comes up am I doing something wrong?? I mean I move the curser to like sailboats click it and there isn't much of a list so how do I find the bigger list that I have seen before?? Thanks
Chris
The Bayfield 32 actually has a fairly wide beam @ 10ft 6in. Only 3ft 10 draft makes it good in Bahamas etc.They didn't point well but with the 'tall rig' were fairly fast on a beam reach.Still looks like a duck to me ;D
Quote from: chris2998 on October 21, 2008, 08:44:29 PM
yeah after posting my question lastnight I looked at more bayfield 32's on yachtworld and they look very narrow probally to narrow to cross the pound with.looking just now at island packet which can't afford and the pacific seacraft I may barely afford when the time comes but the southern cross maybe the only one I'll be able to afford when the time comes. Now the southern cross being that bathtub look and all what is this kinda Hull called?? so maybe I can just type the name into yachtworld and fine more sailboats like the southern cross. I know yachtworld use to have alot more boats but now when I type in for sailboats not much comes up am I doing something wrong?? I mean I move the curser to like sailboats click it and there isn't much of a list so how do I find the bigger list that I have seen before?? Thanks
Chris
use the advanced search on yachtworld (here) (http://www.yachtworld.com/core/listing/advancedSearch.jsp)
Scroll down in the 'boat type' box and select 'All Sail' .. then finish your search from there using price range or boat length or keyword (or all of the above)
By that Hull shape, I think you are talking about the canoe stern or double ended types of hulls.
Also, don't worry about checking out boats that are above your price range. This past week I saw a $50k contessa32 go for about 20k and a $20k pacific seacraft25 go for $7300 on ebay.!
You never know what will become available to you when the time is right, you don't want to miss out on your dreamboat just because you assume it would cost you too much or something like that.
And anyway, I think yachtworld is probably similar to a used car dealership. The brokers gotta make as much as they can. but its definately a great place to window shop and get a good idea of what to expect.
VERY good point dnice. Right now is definitely a buyers market. The smaller new boat sales are pretty off, and used boats don't seem to be bringing anywhere near what they were a year ago. If you see anything even close ( or not so close) to what you are looking for, make an offer- you might be really shocked.
And I think it's only gonna get worse. I think that so seriously that I've let my dealers license lapse, and have stopped even trying to sell boats. As long as the housing market is in the toilet, it'll stay bad too.
The only thing really still moving is the REALLY high dollar stuff- in the 2 -3 -4 million range and up- THOSE guys aren't being hurt like the middle class is.
use the advanced search on yachtworld (here) (http://www.yachtworld.com/core/listing/advancedSearch.jsp)
Scroll down in the 'boat type' box and select 'All Sail' .. then finish your search from there using price range or boat length or keyword (or all of the above)
By that Hull shape, I think you are talking about the canoe stern or double ended types of hulls.
Also, don't worry about checking out boats that are above your price range. This past week I saw a $50k contessa32 go for about 20k and a $20k pacific seacraft25 go for $7300 on ebay.!
You never know what will become available to you when the time is right, you don't want to miss out on your dreamboat just because you assume it would cost you too much or something like that.
And anyway, I think yachtworld is probably similar to a used car dealership. The brokers gotta make as much as they can. but its definately a great place to window shop and get a good idea of what to expect.
[/quote]
Thanks dude and a double ended yeah I have seen that word a few times and didn't know what it meant. I'm a little leary about buying a sailboat off of ebay. I guess it's cool if you go check it out and get it all survayed I just don't know. I've been screwd buying off ebay and I know you can get screwd on yachtworld as well. I seen a pacific seacraft 34ft they claimed it need a little work go for I think like 58000 or so and it was a 87 looked nice now that thing sold fast I know it hasn't been on yachtworld long and have seen other go kinda cheap. I was concerned of did they have major problems for going for so cheap compared to the others or did the owner just need money really bad. I wonder as the houseing market really comes down will boats come down a little as well??
I have been doing lots of reading and from what I have read people talk about if you were to buy a boat it is best to try and get something from up north in more fresh water then in say like Florida because of the salt because the salt really ages a boat really fast hull wise and everything. What are yalls thoughts should I be concentrating more up northe like MA or IL ?? I don't really feel like dealing with shipping a boat but is it that much more worth it?? seems like the boats up there in that area seem to be a little cheaper then down here sometimes. I would almost think they should be more if there in better shape because there in fresh water and are hauled out every winter. What are yalls thoughts?
Quote from: chris2998 on October 22, 2008, 05:35:17 AMThanks dude and a double ended yeah I have seen that word a few times and didn't know what it meant. I'm a little leary about buying a sailboat off of ebay. I guess it's cool if you go check it out and get it all survayed I just don't know. I've been screwd buying off ebay and I know you can get screwd on yachtworld as well. I seen a pacific seacraft 34ft they claimed it need a little work go for I think like 58000 or so and it was a 87 looked nice now that thing sold fast I know it hasn't been on yachtworld long and have seen other go kinda cheap. I was concerned of did they have major problems for going for so cheap compared to the others or did the owner just need money really bad. I wonder as the houseing market really comes down will boats come down a little as well??
I have been doing lots of reading and from what I have read people talk about if you were to buy a boat it is best to try and get something from up north in more fresh water then in say like Florida because of the salt because the salt really ages a boat really fast hull wise and everything. What are yalls thoughts should I be concentrating more up northe like MA or IL ?? I don't really feel like dealing with shipping a boat but is it that much more worth it?? seems like the boats up there in that area seem to be a little cheaper then down here sometimes. I would almost think they should be more if there in better shape because there in fresh water and are hauled out every winter. What are yalls thoughts?
If you can, get a boat from the Great Lakes, since it will have been sailed less than a boat from most of the country outside of the Northeast, due to layup for each winter. It will also be a fresh water boat, which is far less hostile an environment for boats. If you have two otherwise identical boats that are 20 years old, one from Florida and one from Michigan, the one from Florida will generally look older, the rigging and hardware would be in far worse shape, the sails would be in need of replacing, etc.. just due to the greater year round use and greater exposure to UV and salt. That isn't to say that you can't find a bargain down south, especially in this economic climate. :)
I assume the hull itself the fiberglass being in a fresh water enviorment will be still far better then the ones in Florida correct?? Just trying to figure here is it worth the extra trouble to go more north to buy but I guess I'll find that out in time whatever I decide to do. Thanks
Chris
Before my AB talked to me, I was looking at Eastward Ho cutters (mid 70s). I really like their interior, pretty spacious. Very similar to the Data 24 (PSC) and the Flicka with just a slightly different transom.
Not sure how they sail, but the little info i've been able to find is pretty good.
EDIT - I think the Eastward Ho was even built in the same plant as the Southern Crosses! I recall coming across that in my research one time.
Thanks dude I really like the southern cross and I think when it comes down to buying a boat the southern cross will be my first to go walk onto and then a few others to see what is right for me. I like the SC a whole lot but you never know i may walk onto something else and like it even more. I would like to get a boat from up north but we'll just have to see i may find a killer deal in florida who really knows..like others have said the rigging maybe sh*t and all but when I'm done it will be like brand new but anyway thanks a bunch guys
Chris
Quote from: chris2998 on October 22, 2008, 07:38:19 PM
I assume the hull itself the fiberglass being in a fresh water enviorment will be still far better then the ones in Florida correct?? Just trying to figure here is it worth the extra trouble to go more north to buy but I guess I'll find that out in time whatever I decide to do. Thanks
Chris
other than bottom paint, the hull itself should not be any different with freshwater or saltwater boats (or nothern vs. southern).
The difference will be in all the fittings, rigging, and probably sails. The big difference is that the boats up north usually get 'stored' for the winter, meaning, they get the motor winterized, they take down the mast and they either, shrinkwrap and store indoors or, they put it on the hard, for the winter.
Down south, they don't bother with that as much, (although some owners do), which means everything on the boat is exposed to the elements twice as long as the ones up north. plus the addition of salt water environment on all the steel partsl, and the year-around sun on the sails/deck.
With southern boats, the refit may be more extensive, but the general integrity of the boat itself shouldn't be any differnent than a boat from anywhere else.
So if you are looking for something that needs minimal refit, then yeh go up north, but if you are going to refit most of it anyway, it doesn't matter. Other than that, its all up to how well the previous owner took care of it and what it looks like at the time of inspection. You could find the perfect boat in Florida just as easily as Michigan or California. Its all up to the previous owner, the price, and you.
Clark E Ryder's company made several boats of his own as well as manufactured boats for several other brands. The Ryder house brands were Sea Sprite, Southern Cross, and Black Watch. Some of the other brands made by CE Ryder were Portsmouth Yacht/Eastward Ho, Sonar, Nightwind 35 and Quick Step.
The Nightwind 35 is a pretty nice boat from what I understand, but not very common. The Southern Cross boats were both fairly seaworthy and fairly fast... which is a bit of a surprise. My favorite of the Southern Cross boats is probably the 31.
After he left the boat building business, he started a yacht brokerage and consulting company, which is based out of Foster, RI, IIRC.
Actuallly...freshwater boats are generally more prone to blisters than saltwater boats. B U T sun and salt damage to every other part from gelcoat gloss to rust is far worst on say, a Florida boat. PS...Dan...they made a beaty 27 fter as well
Frank-
Yes, CE Ryder made quite a few nice boats.. :) One I'd love to see someday is a SC 35... but haven't had the chance yet.
Quote from: dnice on October 30, 2008, 11:01:04 PM
Quote from: chris2998 on October 22, 2008, 07:38:19 PM
...Just trying to figure here is it worth the extra trouble to go more north to buy ...
other than bottom paint, the hull itself should not be any different with freshwater or saltwater boats (or nothern vs. southern).
Actually northern vs southern does make a difference. The 6 months a year out of the water up north results in significantly less blisters than in, say, Florida, where boats are hauled only every couple years and then only long enough to paint the bottom, etc. While other factors also influence blisters such as the manufacturer's techniques and materials at the time (Valiants had bad blister problems for a period, for example), location does matter.
As Frank pointed out, northern boats just have an easier life in the elements as well. Given the same model and year, a Maine boat is more likely to have fewer problems and be in better shape than a Florida boat. The market seems to reflect this as well, with boat prices generally decreasing as you move from north to south...
Thanks guys yeah I was thinking whatever boat I buy wheather it be north or south I will completely go through it and make it like new and if buying one up north makes my job a little easier and it isn't a HUGE hassel to get it shipped down here then maybe I will buy from up north. I'm what you call ANAL retenant LOL when I buy something used I go completely through it to make new. I'm a welder the gas welder I bought I went completely through and made it look new again and can't even tell you how many offers I get on it. I plan on living on this boat someday so I sure as heck don't want to wake up with it full of water LOL
One question I do have I have thought if I were to buy a 31 SC could I get some jack stands and have the boat lifted and put in my yard on dry land as I go though it refiting everything or is it best and easier just to have it put into a slip and do the work on it while in the water?? I mean motor and tranny work if it needed it would have to be done on land for sure but if I did work on the kitchen and head and all inside the boat could it be done on there water?
Thanks a bunch
Chris