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People, Boats, and Stories => Boat Discussion => Topic started by: Lost Farmboy on June 26, 2011, 01:31:27 AM

Title: Westerly Centaur
Post by: Lost Farmboy on June 26, 2011, 01:31:27 AM
One turned up, and I jumped for it. It's a 1969 Westerly Centaur; number 83 according to the main.

It needs a haul out and bottom painting for starters (last one of either was in 2008), a replacement mainsail, and should have various other work done to it, though nothing else would be required before she would can be sailed. The original Volvo MD2 is still in place and operational, and unless I can get a mainsail within 3 or 4 days it will have to be the mode of propulsion for getting the Centaur up to a boat yard in Port Townsend.

Looking forward to getting her back into sailing condition.
Title: Westerly Centaur
Post by: Captain Smollett on June 26, 2011, 08:16:23 AM
Congrats!  Looking forward to many stories of the refit and cruising.   :)
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: phil416 on June 26, 2011, 10:11:08 AM
Congratulations!  Your gonna love this tough little boat.  Westerlys are everywhere being sailed by enthusiastic owners.  Fairwinds  Phil
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: Jim_ME on June 26, 2011, 03:37:27 PM
Congrats, as well. I had just seen this Centaur in your area and was about to suggest it as a possibility for you. You've beat me to it.

Here's one source (http://www.sailritesails.com/ShowAd.aspx?id=5806&sourceid=0) of the rig and sail dimensions.

I have a project Centaur myself. I like the layout in the early ones that have the dinette, which is elevated so that you can look out the large ports while seated.
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: Lost Farmboy on June 29, 2011, 01:18:31 AM
Thanks for the congrats, and thanks for the rig/sail dimensions Jim!

I've done a little work on her, and am taking her up to be hauled out tomorrow. Having gotten more familiar with the boat, a couple of the through hulls make me nervous. One for the head is weeping water (both plug cock type through hulls are frozen for the head - in the open position) and the one for the engine cooling intake is weeping water more severely - as the bilge is shallow, water is up near the top daily due to this slow leak. Materials for stopping leaks are at hand for this 15-20 mile trip to the boatyard, and I acquired a good dingy to take along, just in case.

I am really looking forward to getting her hauled out, as I don't see a way to fix these leaks until it's out of the water. She could be beached, but I don't think that would be adequate time to enact any meaningful repairs.

Will post again once I find out what the bottom looks like.
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: Lost Farmboy on July 03, 2011, 02:02:08 AM
Made it up to the boatyard, motoring for 10.5 hours with no issues besides learning respect for tidal currents in choke points (spent 3.5 hours traveling less than 1 mile through the Port Townsend Canal, against a 3 knot current).

After she was hauled out of the water, half of a 55 gallon trash can was filled with the aquatics that were on the hull. Blisters were visible everywhere, but it became apparent that these were from water getting between the layers of bottom paint; I have yet to see a sign of a blister in the layers of fiberglass.

I removed the valve side of the weeping engine cooling through hull, which had more than doubled its leak rate on the trip up. This bronze ball valve fitting, which also had the ground attached to it, was threaded into a plastic (hopefully Marelon) through hull. Only two full threads were holding the through hull in place.

Since having her hauled out, and the water leakage stopped from below, I'm now looking at fixing topside leaks. The forward portholes do not seem to be leaking, though the aft set are leaking badly. Some indications point to leakage occurring behind the heat shield around the wood stove, as whoever installed that shield decided to drill through the deck about 8 times to hold it in place. The cleats all need to be redone, this time with backing plates used instead of the 1/4 inch flat washers. Finally, I stripped out all the old vinyl lining and removed the cushions; these were all water damaged, mildewed, and falling apart. I am considering just painting the fiberglass and forgetting about a liner, at least for the near future, to allow easy monitoring of the attachment points of deck equipment for leakage

Other projects not mentioned above include:
-finding/fixing diesel leak (suspected to be from the tank)
-fixing exhaust installation
-rerouting cockpit drainage and bilge pump piping (currently 2 shared through hulls below the waterline; cockpit fails to drain well through either, and bilge pump normally pumps some of bilge contents into cockpit rather than overboard)
-changing the toilet arrangement - either replace with portable in some form, or use a Don Casey idea with a holding tank (top fill, gravity drain overboard)
-painting above the waterline, and the topsides - the fiberglass fibers are exposed in a couple places where the gelcoat appears to have worn thin
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: Jim_ME on July 10, 2011, 02:49:56 PM
Congrats Bryan on getting the boat over to the boatyard and hauled out.

I've heard that the Centaurs have decent speed under power since they have a long waterline and most were equipped with the Volvo MD2B with 25 hp, and that the clear area forward of the prop that the twin keels provide, allows for good water flow past it. The down side may be that this also creates exposure to lobster pots--a real hazard in this area. (At least you can beach the boat to cut one free, if need be.)

A bit scary to imagine that engine intake thru-hull failing, creating a big leak and possibly making the motor unusable at the same time. It underscores the wisdom of having one of those wooden plugs handy to stop any major leak there.

I was thinking that since you are about to work on the head thru-hulls, that it might be a good time to consider whether a different setup would work for you. I've read in other threads about many cruisers who like to eliminate as many thru-hulls as possible, and have installed heads with holding tanks and deck pump-outs or even composting heads, and glassed up the thru-hulls.

I've got some old thru-hulls and seacocks on my Bristol Corinthian 20 that served a (now missing) overboard-discharging head. On a daysailer/overnighter like this, glassing over/eliminating the thru-hulls seems close to a no-brainer, although I may wait until after this season to do it.

Yeah, those vinyl fabric cabin ceiling liners seem to be coming loose on all the Westerly boats that I've seen, and just create a space behind them that you can't ventilate and clean--and allows mildew and mold to grow there. I've seen boats where it is removed and the fiberglass is painted, and that seems to work fine.

The cockpit drain hoses do seem to be overly long. All that I can think of is that Giles wanted to slope the cockpit sole to aft scuppers to keep water away from the motor/trans/stuffing box access panel at the forward end of the cockpit. Or maybe it was so that the cockpit would drain if the boat was sloped slightly while on the hard to cause water in the bilge to flow from under the cabin sole back toward the small sump under the motor, where a bilge pump intake hose may be located. Then he may have located the thru-hulls forward so that the seacocks could be accessed more conveniently from the main cabin.

I'm a bit concerned about the fuel tank fill hose inlet/cap being located in the cockpit sole. Seems to me that since while cruising the cockpit may often have some water in it, that if the gasket at the fill cap were to leak, it would be prone to letting water into the fuel. It may be wise to relocate the fill to a higher place, such as one of the side decks, or aft of one of the seats in the cockpit.  

As far as the main portlights leaking, I've seen articles about the early Centaurs lower aft shroud chainplates location above the portlight causing enough flexing around the portlight to create leaking. On the later models, the chainplate is located forward of the portlight to prevent this (they may have reduced the length of the large portlights so that they are aft of the chainplate). I've seen articles where owners have installed a stainless steel bar bolted to the chainplate and running down across the interior of the portlight, and then bolted it to the cabin trunk side below the portlight, to distribute and carry the load over it. One that I saw had installed a grab handle to this chainplate extension. This may only occur under heavy weather conditions with high strain on the rig, so the leaking that you are experiencing may not be caused by this condition. Still may be good to be aware of if you have plans to go offshore in the future.  

Good luck with your repairs.

-Jim
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: Jim_ME on July 10, 2011, 03:21:21 PM
If you are on a budget, it may be worth checking out some of the used sail sources for a mainsail to use for now.

I'm doing that for the Corinthian 20. At the moment, I just don't want to invest in a new set of sails. Since I have a larger boat and this boat is mostly a daysailer may also be a trailer-sailer part of the time, I'm thinking that a Typhoon at 2000 pounds is plenty large enough, and the extra 700 pounds of the Corinthian is more than I need. I'm also thinking that I would prefer the Typhoon's self-draining/bailing cockpit. (although I have heard that many like the deeper open cockpit of the Corinthian, Ensign, or Sea Sprite daysailer model) I also have a nice genoa that fits the Typhoon. So I may see if I can trade this Corinthian for a Typhoon, and am not sure that I could recoup the investment in a new set of sails in this market. Or would rather wait and invest in a boat that I know that I plan to keep.

In general, over the long term, you often get what you pay for, but I've found that this can be an option to get out sailing at a low initial investment. Here are some sources I've been looking at...

Minneys (http://www.minneysyachtsurplus.com/)
Bacon (http://www.baconsails.com/sailsearch)
Atlantic (http://www.usedsails.com/index.htm?splash.htm~right)

I've done business with Bacon Sails in the past, and have been pleased for the most part, but have no experience with the others.

Perhaps other members have other sources to recommend...and may have more experience with (including the above ones).
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: Lost Farmboy on July 25, 2011, 01:58:15 AM
(been sitting a variaton of this post for a couple of weeks now, sorry for slow reply)

I'm currently leaning towards glassing in the through hulls for the head, and just putting in a portable, which will be sufficient. The old seacocks aren't in that great of shape, and that also eliminates two holes, so it seems like a better choice than putting in a holding tank.  With the engine... I'll have to see what is in need of replacement, besides the fuel tank, through hull, shaft zinc, cutless bearing, and some exhaust hosing. I wouldn't mind losing the diesel smell and gaining a fair amount of space inside, but also like diesel engines, as well as the relative simplicity of this engine (compared to many newer gas or diesel engines). Also, an outboard would need to be installed on a bracket off the back, which I would rather avoid having on this boat. I'll probably leave the cockpit drain lines as they are for this haul out, but run the bilge pumps to a through hull that is above the waterline, probably at the stern of the boat.

Another idea that I'd had with the engine intake through hull would be to install a Y-valve on a cockpit drain through hull; as the cockpit drains are only 4-6 inches aft of the current engine intake (in need of replacement) and at the same depth, it seems like a workable option. My only hesitation is that it would mean isolating one cockpit drain when the engine is in use, though this should not be a problem for the times when I expect to need the diesel. Input on this subject would be most welcome.

I plan to change something with the lower aft shroud chainplates as well; I don't know if they are the major factor in the leaking around the main portlights, or if the bedding has simply expired after four decades of service. Either way, I hope to do something to spread out the force from that chainplate, as well as enlarge or install backing plates for various other fittings which seem lacking.

Thanks for the links to secondhand sail businesses; it looks like J24 and Catalina 25/27 mainsails seem to have similar dimensions to the Centaur's. The jibs are both rather worn as well, with Hasse Sails of Port Townsend having rated one as having a couple of seasons left in it, and the other as dead. Both of these jibs and the main came from the same sailmaker in Cowes, England and were probably original equipment with the boat. A rough estimate of the cost for a new mainsail and a new jib from Hasse would be about $7750 (plus or minus $750) for the pair. Due to my work schedule and the amount of work that is left to do on the boat, I'll hold off on this decision until later, probably close to 9 months or so from now.

Work has progressed far more slowly than I'd like due to various reasons (deciding what is and what is not junk, what must be removed and what can stay, learning how to epoxy, use an orbital sander, take care with painting, being reluctant to rapidly test my new learning) but there is less debris inside, there are fewer poorly bedded fixtures, the companionway and hatch are rebedded and primed for painting, and I am learning more and more about this Westerly Centaur. I just wish that the boats appearance better reflected the time that I have spent working on it.

Incidentally, the Centaur is currently unnamed, and portless. I have not yet decided on how to deal with either of these issues, though I have considered "Meerschweinchen" as a name, as it contains special meaning to me. I am looking forward to sanding the stern and discovering what name(s) may be hidden under paint. Or perhaps this is how it has always been...

Jim, thanks for your responses, and for the links to secondhand sail businesses. The Corinthian looks like a good boat from the pictures/descriptions that I've seen. If I hadn't been wanting to get a boat with the space to live aboard for extended periods of time, I would have been looking at boats more like her.
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: Stefan on February 06, 2012, 05:55:12 PM
Wondering how your refurb is progressing?

I owned a Centaur for 25 yrs and lived aboard for a few. We used to have a good US based discussion list back in the 90's.

Stefan
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: marujo_sortudo on February 10, 2012, 01:38:04 PM
A couple of thoughts on points mentioned above:

1.  I'm happy with my cockpit sole fuel fill and would be happy with any such arrangement as long as it was not at the lowest point of the cockpit.  I don't find my side decks to be much drier, but then again, I like to sail in big winds and also wash down the deck regularly.  As a plus, any fuel spill in the cockpit is somwhat contained.  I wish I didn't know that.  :-[

2.  I wouldn't use a Y valve to connect both a cockpit drain the engine intake to the same through hull.  Firstly, lots of gunk tends to go down through cockpit drains, e.g. hair, bits of food, etc.  I wouldn't want this gunking up or chipping away at my impeller, etc.  Furthermore, any engine intake through hull should have a strainer to block big bits coming in, but this would only make it easier for the cockpit drain to clog.  My engine intake is plumbed to the same through hull as the galley's salt water pump which seems a sensible solution, if you have one and it is nearby.
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: Lost Farmboy on July 20, 2012, 01:40:05 AM
It's been a while since an update, and less has been accomplished than I would like - I failed to recognize just how little time I had available, underestimated time for work, and did not decide on a plan for work to be accomplished before putting her in the water until relatively recently. Getting her back in the water with minimal improvements above the waterline is the plan I am now following, and which I ought to have started with. Appearance inside and (to a degree) topside will be taking the backseat it should already have had.
I am in the process of pulling the inboard diesel; too much needs replacement and repair on the old beast. An outboard motor (about 5-8 hp) will be replacing it due to the reasons mentioned in previous posts, and on most pro-outboard discussions. Many components are disconnected and removed, with portions of the engine block remaining. That should be lifted out in August (boatyard hours and work schedule will allow for lifting out inboard at that time), unless breaking it down further for removal makes it small enough to remove by hand. Volvo MD2B parts, anyone?
The installed head is removed, with only the through hulls remaining to be removed and the holes filled. The diesel?s seawater intake will require filling as well.
The wood stove will not be reinstalled; it is not practical for the insulation and fuel space it demands. Looking at other stoves will be a project for later.
The exhaust overboard will be used for the bilge pump overboard, allowing the cockpit drain overboards to be used for that purpose alone, and pump overboards to come out above the water line.
Through hulls below the waterline will be reduced to two cockpit drains and one sink drain. All will have their hardware replaced due to current materials and material conditions being unsatisfactory or questionable at best.
No mainsail has been purchased at this time.
No outboard or mount has been purchased at this time. Have looked at mounts, and am not certain of what type would be best, other than (based on other sailboats I?ve seen) ensuring that there is adequate lift to prevent the prop from being in the water when not in use (and ensuring it is deep enough when in use ? something that may be difficult to tell due to the change in ballast from removing the engine. For an outboard, a manual start two stroke would be preferred for the sake of simplicity. Don?t have an outboard in mind, though I?m planning on going for a used one. Any advice on an age/make of outboard to look for? Ones I have seen in the area include a ?98 Mercury 8hp ($850) and a ?77 Johnson Sea Horse 6hp ($300).
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: matt195583 on July 22, 2012, 08:10:25 PM
G'day, regarding the sink drain, I am in the same boat I have 7 thu hull fittings only 4 of which are used 3 being blanked off and filled with epoxy filler ( they will be done properly next haul out. I had planned on removing the seacock for the sink and using a   lift out tub for the sink , then i came up with the idea of mounting a whale pump directly to the sink so when the plug is pulled you give the pump a few cranks and pump it out a fitting that is above the water line.  just a thought .
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: CharlieJ on July 22, 2012, 11:37:31 PM
I did a stainless steel lift out sink on Tehani, Have been very happy with it. It's a steam table tray from a restaurant supply house, cost 14 bucks (then- $18 now) and works just fine. No pump to mess with, no opening in the boat..

Have cruised some 10,000 miles all told using it like that-3 trips.,

Try it that way for a bit- you can ALWAYS cut a hole in the hull, not so easy to seal one.

Necessity of course just has a plastic dishpan, usually used in the cockpit.
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: Lost Farmboy on July 23, 2012, 02:24:11 AM
Thanks for the responses!

I'd been thinking along roughly the same lines as Matt for the future, connecting either the drain, or a very small holding tank beneath the sink, as an input for the manual drain pump for pumping overboard. The Navy has influenced me in some ways with this, in that it is normal for drain pumps to pump from multiple locations, using a common line, with only a single ball valve separating each location from the common line.

However, at this time, I will be replacing that through hull with a new one (currently it drains very rapidly with the valve open - or shut), using it as originally designed. Later, as this through hull is below the water line, and there are already two pumps for the sink (both fresh water - why??), I intend to change this over to being a seawater suction for a galley pump.

After just thinking about that a bit more, the current through hull location may be a bit too close to the waterline to function well as a suction - I may have another one to fill in rather than replace.
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: marujo_sortudo on July 23, 2012, 06:46:09 PM
Often inlet thru-hulls are smaller, too, i.e., safer, less expensive.  One might even be able to wish that a direct strike might only claim the strainer, but that could just be wishful thinking.
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: matt195583 on July 24, 2012, 05:13:44 PM
I also picked up salt water for the galley from the engine inlet ( the inlet for the head also comes from there) . I only hooked it up before this use a bucket trip, it runs to a hand pump at the sink although I will change it to a foot pump when i get a chance . Foot pump equals pure awesomeness.

Having the salt water at the galley saves a massive amount of water, although i suppose you could always use a bucket to get some.  Myself and a friend have been cruising for about a month now and we topped off the tanks after 2 1/2 weeks for a total of 38 liters .......... That is 38 out of 300 + 2 x 20l water cans.
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: marujo_sortudo on July 25, 2012, 09:19:45 AM
I have one through-hull for both galley salt water and engine intake, as well.  There is an additional ball valve for the galley portion so that if it is leaking, if can be shut off but the engine will still be usable.  Seems like a sound arrangement to me.
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: Lost Farmboy on August 07, 2012, 02:59:35 AM
A couple of ball valves that will not be returning to my boat. Can you identify the major problems?
(hope the picture shows - if not clear, a code on both these valves is "MS58")
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: Oldrig on August 07, 2012, 02:58:54 PM
It's a good idea to dump the ball valves and replace them with true seacocks, if you can get them.
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: doug on August 07, 2012, 08:11:44 PM
what is the difference between ball valves and a seacock?
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: CharlieJ on August 07, 2012, 08:55:01 PM
Well made ball valves work just fine- almost the same method. It's GATE valves that you really want to avoid.

Difference is, with either ball valves or sea cocks, you can tell by the handle position if the valve is open or closed. A 90 degree turn does the job.

On the other hand, a gate valve ( like your home water faucet) screws a gate across the opening, and if something happens to get in there, there is no way to know if it's really closed or not.
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: Lost Farmboy on August 08, 2012, 04:17:41 AM
Another major factor that makes the ball valves superior to gate valves for seawater is simplicity. Ball valves simply require the handle to rotate the ball (as you can see, the ball valve on the left in the picture has failed in this regard - though the resistance to operating the handle is similar to the other, functioning ball valves). Gate valves require undamaged threads, both on the stem and bonnet of the valve, a good connection to the wedge, and an unobstructed seating surface, as Charlie stated. If any of these fail, the valve will no longer function properly.

As far as seacocks go, I'd rather stay with ball valves (though bronze rather than 37% zinc brass) while probably using a flanged adaptor (Groco sells them, don't know if others do)  to go from the through hull to the valve. This would make switching out a valve far easier than if a traditional seacock was used.
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: CharlieJ on August 08, 2012, 07:45:18 AM
Or Marelon valves. Problem with Marelon, in both ball and seacock versions, is that they have to be "exercised" once in a while or they can get sticky. Just close and open each one once in a while. The literature that comes with them  tells you this.

But then bronze valves should be also, if for no other reason than to be sure they DO work. Even bronze ones can get "sticky".

I can't say for sure, but the ones in the picture look like non-marine, brass valves to me.

But again- I solved the problem on both Tehani and Necessity with fiberglass and epoxy. Neither boat has any fittings below the waterline. Tehani has a pair of deck drains, leading to bronze ball valves, but they are above the boot top.
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: s/v Faith on August 08, 2012, 05:27:19 PM
Quote from: Lost Farmboy on August 07, 2012, 02:59:35 AM
A couple of ball valves that will not be returning to my boat. Can you identify the major problems?
(hope the picture shows - if not clear, a code on both these valves is "MS58")

Ah yes!  The rare 'high flow' ball valves... I had one like that.  Rare, but sadly not too rare....

Glad you got them off before you tried to close one to service the hose!
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: Lost Farmboy on August 09, 2012, 02:16:25 AM
Took off the one remaining old ball valve today, tried to disconnect it from the elbow. The adapter between the elbow and ball valve shattered, with the metal's appearance and way it broke reminding me of a terracotta flower pot. Bronze valves and fittings will be replacing these; I considered Marelon, but it does not inspire as much confidence in me as bronze does.

Charlie- I will be looking at moving the cockpit drains to above the waterline in the future, but would like to see how removing the inboard affects the waterline and trim prior to doing so. Previously, there was normally water just below the level of the cockpit floor in the drains, hopefully this will change.
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: Lost Farmboy on January 04, 2013, 04:47:20 AM
Haven't updated for a while, wish that I could say more had changed on the boat. Here's what has happened:

-Inboard diesel & related components are gone (amazing how much space there is available back there)
-Wood stove is sold, chimney replaced with mushroom vent
-Went underway for several months, while underway analyzed finances and recognized that either I could keep boat or duplex, aiming to move onto boat in late February, at which point it should be moored at local marina, all else follows from this choice
-Holes below waterline and in cockpit from head and motor closed up by boatyard (decided it was best for them to do it due to lack of experience, cool weather, and very limited available time)
-Purchased shop refurbished '73 Evinrude 6hp (22" shaft) for propulsion and outboard motor mount to put it on
-Painting bottom following preservation of keels with CRC rust converter, sealing around keel / hull joints (Life Caulk), and checking tightness of keel nuts.
-Installing 120v, 30A shore power system (2 dual outlets & expansion room on switchboard)
-Planning to start installing basic 12v system, charging to be done by shore power only initially
-Groco ball valves ordered to replace the old ones serving as seacocks
-Installing different cleats (used ones of Herreshoff type); previous cleats were some of first items to be removed due to pulling through deck; much heavier backing will be used on these

What to cook on is something that concerns me at the moment; had intended to use my old propane camp stove temporarily, but it is two wide for the space set aside. However, while cleaning out lockers today, I found the wood stove's predecessor (according to the previous owner) which I had forgotten about in one of the storage compartments (along with many more items than I would have thought). There's a picture of it attached, from my limited knowledge/understanding of these things, it is not a pressurized stove, but it uses liquid fuel. Would it be a kerosene stove? It does have small pans beneath each burner which might be for preheating. The only labels which I have seen on it thus far are on the knobs, and read "Vulcano Alemania", which I am fairly certain translates as "Volcano Germany". Does anyone know anything about these stoves, and would it probably be usable / safe?(http://img189.imageshack.us/img189/3058/dscf1497d.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/189/dscf1497d.jpg/)

Thanks!
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: maxiSwede on January 05, 2013, 03:11:31 PM
I have never heqrd of thqt brqnd for a stove. but kerosene it is not unlesss you cqn locate q pump to pressurize the fuel and a tqnk too. Kerosene neesd to be pressurised to burn with q hot blue qnd soot free flqme.

My guess is it. either propqne or alcohol then, You should be qble to figure thqt out from the look of things. like burners, fittings if qny etc..... hope this helps
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: rorik on January 05, 2013, 05:14:39 PM
I believe that's a WWII vintage German Army field stove. Runs on gasoline.

Start here:

http://www.spiritburner.com/fusion/showtopicforreply.php?iframe/1/fid/232/tid/29692/pid/257771/post/257771/
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: CharlieJ on January 05, 2013, 05:47:18 PM
I have a Vulcano stove. Had it since the early 70s. But it's a one burner and burns kerosene. Looks very different from that one.

I agree that it isn't kero- must have a pump for those. I'd bet alcohol. which used to be quite popular.

Alcohol is probably THE most expensive fuel going, for long term use.
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: CharlieJ on January 05, 2013, 06:19:38 PM
Quote from: rorik on January 05, 2013, 05:14:39 PM
I believe that's a WWII vintage German Army field stove. Runs on gasoline.

Start here:

http://www.spiritburner.com/fusion/showtopicforreply.php?iframe/1/fid/232/tid/29692/pid/257771/post/257771/

Got that exact stove- runs on Kerosene. That's the one I refer to in the last post. Working to refurb it right now. Need a couple gaskets and it'll be back in use aboard Necessity.

I'd post a pic, but it says the folder is full.
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: CharlieJ on January 05, 2013, 06:28:50 PM
stove
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: CapnK on January 05, 2013, 06:32:58 PM
Noticed this in one of the spiritburner.com photos; it says "Use Only Kerosene", although somewhat illegibly, just to the left of the datestamp:

(http://www.spiritburner.com/fusion/gallery/1620/1353184088-IMG_0627_opt.jpg)
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: Lost Farmboy on January 06, 2013, 02:14:25 AM
Looks like it is an alcohol stove (definitely can't pressurize tank with vented cap) - functionally identical to the Vulcano 261 here: http://www.spiritburner.com/fusion/showtopic.php?tid/26809/post/new/#NEW

Probably would have been good to show the underside of mine as well.
(http://img824.imageshack.us/img824/2475/dscf1499pd.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/824/dscf1499pd.jpg/)

Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: Lost Farmboy on February 26, 2013, 02:46:36 AM
Some things have been accomplished since I last posted:

Through hulls-
Decided that trying to save money by using the old was not wise. Removed the old through hulls  and the wood backing pads, as well as the drains in the cockpit (same fittings as through hulls) and will be replacing the sink drain. Replaced with new bronze Groco through hulls, ball valves, and flanged adapters using composite decking material for backing. Added xbronze elbows and hose barbs as appropriate to reduce bending of hoses. Replaced hose for cockpit drains with Trident VAC XHD Sanitation hose (PVC reinforced vinyl), used 2x SS T-bolt hose clamps at each end of each hose to ensure secure fit. Replaced hose for sink drain with Shields Multiflex (PVC reinforced vinyl), using 2x SS AWAB hose clamps at each end of hose, planning to keep through hull shut unless required to be open for use.
Intend to switch to above the waterline cockpit drains in the future  (figured out a possible way to do it partway though work on current through  hulls.

Keels-
Spent at least 24 hours using air scaler on keels to remove the majority of the rust. Followed up with 2-3 coats of Corroseal, followed by 3 coats of Interprotect, followed by fairing compound / epoxy mixed for fairing (depending on area), following up with 3 coats of MAS epoxy with a relatively small amount of colloidal silica thickener for a barrier to moisture (2 coats complete), following with bottom paint.

Stove -
Decided that it would be best to sell the Vulcano alcohol stove and go with a gimballed single burner. Bought a Seacook stove with original propane burner, had a "leg" for one of the cooking surface supports break while trying to loosen that support to allow for adjustment, "repaired" with JB weld & reinforced other legs with same. Plan is to convert over to kerosene when an appropriate stove is found.

Topside-
Removed boards from cockpit seats - badly weathered and leaking around many bolts - filled holes
Installed cleats - 12" pair replacing the single previous anchor cleat, 10" pair replacing previous cleats aft, heavy backing blocks and improved bedding for all.

Rebedded - All chain loops (not exactly plates) for standing rigging, mast tabernacle, old diesel tank fill, and handrails

Dewatering system-
Previous 1.5" exhaust overboard is now bilge pump outlet (replaced through hull, added 90 degree street fitting and cross fitting with plans to add on as necessary to make a manifold for 2 or 3 bilge pumps to be plumbed to the same outlet using independent hoses - previous setup was pvc "T" fittings in the cockpit drain lines, with one for a manual bilge pump, one for an electric bilge pump, and both below the waterline. Bilge pumps  will initially be a manual Gusher 25, electric (using Groco pressure sensor based level detector) Jabsco pump (about 6 gpm, for removal of condensation and minor leakage while boat is docked and I am away)

Mainsail-
Purchased a used main from Masthead Sailing Gear out of St. Petersburg, FL. Main was originally for a B-25 (sailboat, not bomber) and has more features than the original main - 1 reef and a flattening reef, loose footed, cunningham , leach and foot lines - while being (if my calculations are correct) nearly identical in its measurements, which was my primary concern. Due to the mast being removed, I have not actually had the chance to see if my measurements were correct...

Mast-
Removed old anchor light, using Davis light for replacement (mounted on short piece of SS pipe epoxied into mast cap), painted cap of mast to protect epoxy (chose gray, as it is not overly different in color from the oxidized aluminum of much of the rest of the mast).
Added steaming light/foredeck light combination (no steaming light previously)
Disassembled, cleaned, and reassembled original winch on mast; will be leaving main and jib halyards at mast rather than running back to cockpit due to various reasons and will be utilizing this winch once more.
Ran wire (5 strands, independent grounds for anchor and combination lights) up mast, bound together with zip ties roughly every 2 feet (31' mast), used small marelon thru-hull to run wires out of mast, with the threaded portion to the outside; will use the same through the cabin top and run a 2-3 ft length of hose between the two to keep water out of both the mast and cabin.
Replaced plastic Seaway blocks with Tufnol blocks; like how the other Tufnol blocks and cleats have lasted for the past 40 years with minimal signs of wear.
Switching to using rivets for holding on the mast cap and foot, previously had stainless steel machine screws threaded into aluminum alloy foot and those screws that came out took the threads with them. Rivets seem more practical.

120v AC Wiring
Made the mistake of starting on installing a very small system (2 outlets + charger), did not realize until too late that I could have paid for a solar panel or two with the expenses this small system has incurred in parts. Using 6 position Blue Sea distribution/breaker panel, 2 gfci outlets with covers intended for outdoor use, Noco Genius Gen1 charger (10A maximum output, single bank; should be sufficient for group 27 battery which will support minor DC loading),  30A Marinco socket, and upon recommendation from boatyard's electrical specialist, installing hull mounted grounding block  to ground the AC safety (green) wire and negative DC wire to the water. This is to continue to provide protection if the marina (or any other boat) has incorrect or degraded wiring.

Lighting & Heating
Initially using nothing but kerosene lamps and a kerosene lantern - 2 "Fastnet" style lamps are on order for the main cabin, and a "Petromax 150 cp" knockoff lantern is also on order, also for the main cabin. The kerosene lamp (by Weems and Plath, I think) that was in the main cabin will be moved to the v-berth. An electric radiant oil heater will be used for supplemental heat as needed for the time being.
Also, due to my lack of experience with combustible lighting/cooking and associated ventilation requirements, I decided that it was prudent to purchase a CO alarm/detector; it is rated for a 7 year life, has a display of CO levels, is battery operated, and at $37 is a worthwhile investment for  learning what ventilation is required to keep CO levels at safe levels, and warning me if I failed to keep them at safe levels. I do not expect to be replacing it after the 7 years are up, as I expect to have learned what ventilation is required for safe operation of lamps, lantern, and stove by that time.

That's about it at the moment. I'd be happy to answer any questions.
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: Frank on February 26, 2013, 09:46:38 AM
great update....you've been busy!! any pics??
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: Lost Farmboy on February 28, 2013, 04:08:01 AM
Will have pictures up, once I stop forgetting and leaving my camera at the boat. It's been up there (43 miles away) for the past four days when I've meant to bring it back each time. Hopefully tomorrow later today I'll get it.
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: David_Old_Jersey on February 28, 2013, 08:01:54 AM
Pics would be of interest  8).

Also would be interesting to hear how you get on with the Petromax 150 cp (knockoff lantern) - I like the look of them, just read mixed reviews on the internet........
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: Lost Farmboy on March 01, 2013, 06:20:41 PM
Here's a couple pictures, one is a progression on refinishing the keels, the other is a view of the oddball approach that I set up for routing bilge pump hoses. The photos are thumbnails, click to enlarge.

(http://imageshack.us/a/img12/345/progressionofkeelssmall.th.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/12/progressionofkeelssmall.jpg/)

Progression of Centaur keels (from top left, pictures vary between port & stbd keels): 1) before starting work, with exception of running needlegun along top edge  2) after one pass with the needlegun  3) after two passes with the needlegun  4) immediately after applying Corroseal (rust converter)  5) after Corroseal dried (used about 4 or 5 coats total)  6) after application of Interprotect (3 coats)  7) after fairing completed, and three coats of MAS epoxy with colloidal silica applied  8) after Amercoat 671 (if I recall correctly) was painted over the epoxy

(http://imageshack.us/a/img593/7681/drainoverboardcockpitlo.th.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/593/drainoverboardcockpitlo.jpg/)

Future hose run for bilge pumps, inside cockpit locker - on right, manifold of 1.5" bronze, using (replacement) through transom/hull fitting, previously intended for engine exhaust. Vertical 5" sections of bronze (1.5" one visible, 1/2" one blocked from view) used to reduce possibility of backflow down another pump's hose as the same overboard fitting is used for both pumps. Plugged fitting visible to camera is for future expansion.  - on left, 4" PVC is fitted to a closet (toilet) flange bolted to matching flange below (both with stainless steel bolts between their stainless steel rings to prevent ingress of water into cabin/engine compartment from locker. Engine exhaust hose was previously routed through smaller, broken off pipe that was mounted in the same location.

I'd be happy to answer questions about either, and will post more pictures at a later time.

edits: added blurb about thumbnails, added descriptions lost in transfer to Imageshack, disabled smileys to permit " 8) " to show correctly
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: Frank on March 01, 2013, 08:15:04 PM
Thanks for the pics....the keel looks great!!  Grog to ya
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: Seafarer on April 08, 2013, 09:11:42 PM
Walmart sells an $18 electric ceramic heater made by Sunbeam that that will sweat you out of your boat. I have one on my Island Packet 26, and even with the thermostat turned way down it kept the boat warm on the coldest winter nights of the year (which, being in St. Petersburg, FL, were "only" ~30 degrees). I highly recommend this unit to anyone that utilizes shore power!

The unexpected but much appreciated benefit is the lack of humidity in the cabin. I'm sure that once the weather warms up (it's already started getting uncomfortably warm) it'll go back to feeling like a sauna aboard.
Title: Re: Westerly Centaur
Post by: Lost Farmboy on April 13, 2013, 05:41:31 AM
The radiant oil heater seemed to work alright for me, could keep the inside at about 65 at the 7 amp setting when 40ish outside. I have used a ceramic radiant heater in the past, but did not want something that was as hot to the touch on the boat. The multifuel lantern that I purchased seems like it will add a noticeable amount of heat, though I need to get a new globe; the one included melted and curled over, then cracked, due to not withstanding the blowtorch preheater.

The larger issue that I had was condensation; a big project that I worked towards was painting various interior surfaces, and I rapidly discovered that a heat lamp (250 watt was readily available) was a valuable investment for painting in late winter/early spring. Also, condensation gathered underneath the cushion that I was sleeping on with great rapidity. Hopefully the day/night vent that I installed will provide adequate ventilation to prevent excessive damage from condensation.

For the time being, I am enjoying the time on sunny Guam due to work having me on a completely different type of "boat".