Tips on Buying Gas

[Grime]

Stolen from a friend on another forum.


TIPS ON BUYING GASOLINE

Here at the Kinder Morgan Pipeline where I work in San Jose, CA we
deliver about 4 million gallons in a 24-hour period thru the pipeline.
One day is diesel the next day is jet fuel, and gasoline, regular and
premium grades. We have 34-storage tanks here with a total capacity of
16,800,000 gallons.

Only buy or fill up your car or truck in the early morning when the
ground temperature is still cold. Remember that all service stations
have their storage tanks buried below ground. The colder the ground the
more dense the gasoline, when it gets warmer gasoline expands, so buying
in the afternoon or in the evening....your gallon is not exactly a
gallon. In the petroleum business, the specific gravity and the
temperature of the gasoline, diesel and jet fuel, ethanol and other
petroleum products plays an important role.

A 1-degree rise in temperature is a big deal for this business. But the
service stations do not have temperature compensation at the pumps.

When you're filling up do not squeeze the trigger of the nozzle to a
fast mode. If you look you will see that the trigger has three (3)
stages: low, middle, and high. In slow mode you should be pumping on low
speed, thereby minimizing the vapors that are created while you are
pumping. All hoses at the pump have a vapor return. If you are pumping
on the fast rate, some other liquid that goes to your tank becomes
vapor. Those vapors are being sucked up and back into the underground
storage tank so you're getting less worth for your money.

One of the most important tips is to fill up when your gas tank is HALF
FULL or HALF EMPTY. The reason for this is, the more gas you have in
your tank the less air occupying its empty space. Gasoline evaporates
faster than you can imagine. Gasoline storage tanks have an internal
floating roof. This roof serves as zero clearance between the gas and
the atmosphere, so it minimizes the evaporation. Unlike service
stations, here where I work, every truck that we load is temperature
compensated so that every gallon is actually the exact amount.

Another reminder, if there is a gasoline truck pumping into the storage
tanks when you stop to buy gas, DO NOT fill up--most likely the gasoline
is being stirred up as the gas is being delivered, and you might pick up
some of the dirt that normally settles on the bottom. Hope this will
help you get the most value for your money.

DO SHARE THESE TIPS WITH OTHERS!

WHERE TO BUY USA GAS, THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT TO KNOW. READ ON

Gas rationing in the 80's worked even though we grumbled about it. It
might even be good for us! The Saudis are boycotting American goods. We
should return the favor. An interesting thought is to boycott their
GAS.

Every time you fill up the car, you can avoid putting more money into
the coffers of Saudi Arabia. Just buy from gas companies that don't
import their oil from the Saudis.

Nothing is more frustrating than the feeling that every time I fill-up
the tank, I am sending my money to people who are trying to kill me, my
family, and my friends.

I thought it might be interesting for you to know which oil companies
are the best to buy gas from and which major companies import Middle
Eastern oil.

These companies import Middle Eastern oil:

Shell.......................... 205,742,000 barrels

Chevron/Texaco......... 144,332,000 barrels

Exxon /Mobil.............. 130,082,000 barrels

Marathon/Speedway... 117,740,000 barrels

Amoco...........................62,231,000 barrels

Citgo gas is from South America, from a Dictator who hates Americans.
If you do the math at $30/barrel, these imports amount to over $18
BILLION! (oil is now $90 - $100 a barrel)

Here are some large companies that do not import Middle Eastern oil:


Sunoco.................0 barrels

Conoco.................0 barrels

Sinclair................0 barrels

BP/Phillips............0 barrels

Hess......................0 barrels

ARCO...................0 barrels

If you go to Sunoco.com <http://sunoco.com/> , you will get a list of
the station locations near you.

All of this information is available from the Department of Energy and
each is required to state where they get their oil and how much they are
importing.

Just though I would share this. Some of the info I sure didn't know. Will be filling up early in the mornings or late at night from now on.

[Captain Smollett]

ARRRRRGGGGGHH.

This is mostly myth, and gets soundly debunked on every site it appears on.

I wish this poop would just go away.

[Zen]

YEah I heard that too.

Here is how you really save gas on your boat...

Use the sails !

;D

[Grime]

Myth "No" Poop yes if you are a stock holder in the major oil companies.  Sure don't want the public to know how you are running to the bank laughing all the way. 


I put one point to a test today before I posted this myth poop.

In the past when I went to buy gas here in Port O'Connor. I would just pull the handle full up and pump. WOW 26 cents show up before I hear the gas flow. So today I eased the handle and WOW I could hear the gas flow right off the bat. So is the station stealing my 26 cents when I pull the handle full or am I getting 26 cents of fumes through the meter? I know I'm not getting the gas. Tested that in a 1 gallon gas can.

Town Pump, Boulder, Montana. If you buy gas right after the delivery truck finishes delivering gas you are in big trouble. Proven more times than I can remember.

My point is.

If this Myth and Poop saves just one person just a little that means they have more to spend on their sailboat. Maybe someone just like me on SS.

[AdriftAtSea]

Actually, IIRC, the part about the temperature is not myth.  There's currently a class action suit about it IIRC.  The pumps are calibrated to pump 1 gallon at 60˚F...but when it's 95˚F, you're not getting as much gas by weight as you would at 60˚F.  :)  And at 30˚F you're getting more than you would at 60˚F. :)

Can't say much about anything else on the post though.

[Captain Smollett]

Snopes.com has this to say:

This collection of purported money-saving tips for buying gasoline is another item difficult to classify as strictly true or false.  It's not completely false in that one or more of the tips might actually result in some savings (however modest), but it can't fairly be classified as true either, as the practical utility of all of these tips is disputed, and the economic gains to be had from following them is highly questionable.

(emphasis added)

Sorry guys, but the bulk of this "advice" is urban legend.  Even the bit about the volume of delivery at different temperatures is suspect - I've seen "accurate at any delivery temperature and pressure" on many a gas pump.  (Dan, please don't start an argument on this...I ain't in the mood to debate it.  Believe me or not, I really don't care).

As I said, this has been making the rounds on the 'Net for a quite a while now.

[AdriftAtSea]

Yes, but the gas pumps measure by volume, not mass... and as gasoline heats up, it expands... reducing the mass of gasoline you purchase for the same volume.  Simple physics.  The labels are accurate... the pumps deliver ONE GALLON of gasoline at any temperature or pressure... that isn't the problem...they don't deliver the same MASS OF GASOLINE.  Gasoline's energy content varies by volume, but not by mass.

[CharlieJ]

David- off this topic- but if you are interested in the dinghy, give me a call

[CapnK]

As with everything, there's probably both some truth and some untruth, with the info in the original post. There usually is with just about everything, it seems. "Compromise", or "Yin/Yang", rearing it's ever-present head, in a slightly different form.

A lot of it probably depends on how you argue it, as to how 'true' it might be. But - that's arguing minutiae, and - to me, at least - there ain't much point in doing that. Not on this particular topic.

Stainless alloys - now *there's* a topic for minutiae and some good arguing... ;D

Or - let's get some questions going in the Man O'Facturers thread, steel vs synthetic line for rigging...  8)

[AdriftAtSea]

BTW, here's a link to a US Govt. PDF on the issue.  LINK

From the PDF:

Gasoline expands when temperatures rise and contracts when temperatures fall. The
energy content of gasoline, however, is directly related to its weight, not its volume. 
Therefore, the energy content of gasoline does not correspondingly increase when
gasoline volume expands.  The standard coefficient of gasoline's expansion/contraction
equals 0.069 % per degree Fahrenheit.

If the gasoline is at 90˚F, then it will have expanded by 2%.  Multiply that by the millions of gallons that are sold during a summer... it starts to add up. Fortunately, it doesn't make that much difference to us sailors, since we don't use all that much fuel over the course of a season.   A powerboater who burns 300 gallons a week is going to take a much bigger hit.

[Lost Lake]

I also don't want to argue the point, but the fuel is stored in underground tanks. The temperature will be quite stable. Oh sure when the semi delivers it the gas may be at 80 degrees if the truck sat overnight in the desert, but when the fuel hits the balance of 55 degree fuel in the subterranean tank it should cool quickly. As far as the minute difference between 55 and 65 degree fuel is concerned, it's not enough to change your trip so that you fill up after a cool night or the day after the delivery truck comes to town.

Fast pump or slow? I don't know anything about that. I fill up my car twice a day quite often, I don't have time to mess with flow rates. I'd listen to solid proof if anyone has it, as I do burn several thousand gallons a year....

[macdiver]

As noted previously, there is some truth and some misinformation in the recommendations. 

As Lost Lake said, the temperature in an underground storage tank will not vary throughout the day but it will vary over the course of a year in places where it gets cold.  The real question is does it matter.  As my professors used to say, the world is a math problem. 

Since I do not know the density of gasoline I am going to make some assumptions.  First, most hydrocarbon liquids have a specific gravity around 0.8.  Specific gravity is the density of the liquid divided by the density of water.  I will assume that the specific gravity is around 0.8.  Next, water is the most dense at 4 degrees C (approx 40 F).  At 40 F the density of water is 8.345 lbs/gal.  Using 0.8 specific gravity, gasoline would be 6.676 lb/gal.  In New Jersey, the hottest day just approaches 100 F.  At 100 F the density of water is 8.287 lb/gal.  Gasoline would be 6.63 lb/gal.  This works out to be a 0.69% difference.  Therefore, to get the same energy, one will need to put 1.0069 gallons in the car during the summer as compared to 1 gallon in the winter.  Using the projected $4.00 per gallon cost this would be an extra 3 cents per 0.0069 gallon.  Since the price you pay is based on 68 F, the oil company is loosing money in the winter and gaining in the summer and probably balances out overall.  If it did not balance out, the companies would be the first to add temperature compensation to not loose money.

As far as the flow rate is concerned, the initial rush of air mentioned above was from the nozzle filling with fuel after the shutoff valve located in the nozzle.  After the valve shuts off, the same quantity of fuel is usually spilled down the side of your car while the nozzle empties.  The same volume of air is pushed out of the nozzle regardless of flow rate.  The flow meter is not measuring and charging you for air.  Flow meters measure either a liquid or a gas but not both (unless it is a highly specialized type not used at gas stations.)  The vapor recovery system is recovering the fuel vapors displaced from your tank by the incoming fuel.  The quantity is based strictly on the total fuel pumped not the flow rate.  If you pump 10 gallons of gas you displace 10 gallons of vapor.  I'm not clear why the flow rate and vapor recovery system was supposed to be costing you more when you pumped on high, the pump is measuring the total amount of fuel that passes a certain point in the pump.

Unless the tank is new, there is probably sediment in the tank which will be stirred up during filling.  This applies to both the underground tank and your car's tank.  This is why the fuel filter needs to be replaced on a regular basis.  Probably not a bad idea to not fill up while the underground tank is being filled but I think that there are filters in the lines as well.

P.S.  I tried posting a previous message similar to this one but it did not go through.  If it appears, I apologize for the double post.

[Lost Lake]

I know in the small planes I fly, we calculate fuel weight at 6lbs per gallon. And if you fill a plane and let it sit on the tarmac for a while in the sun, the wings will start burping fuel on the ground.

So yes, fuel expands as it warms, but I just think there isn't much difference in the storage tank between day and night or even winter and summer. Or I should say, not enough difference that I would worry about it. Even if it was a buck a fill-up difference, I wouldn't change my day to fuel at a different time. When I run out, I fill up.  ;D

[Bill NH]

Yeah, you really have to be talking big quantities for this to make a difference.  When I was mate on a coastwise product tanker we carried 15 MILLION gallons of regular, mid-grade, premium and diesel from the refinery in Texas City to various terminals from Mobile, Tampa, Port Everglades, Jacksonville, etc on up to Norfolk, a round trip every 12 days.  Lots of loading and discharging.  With that quantity you can't believe the detail which the cargo was accounted for.  Representatives of three different interests (the ship, the terminal and the cargo owner) all gauging tanks, measuring temperatures and specific gravities, inspecting tanks...  what a circus when you're trying to make a sailing time.  But with those quantities it really does make a difference...