The original Scoot discussion...

[newt]

I crossed the gulf stream in 20-25 knot northerlies from Miami to Bimini. I would not have gone, but I was in a sailing school "and yer not the captain" as my instructor said to me. Jerked around our 50 ft. Gibsea quite a bit, and I was so seasick that I was bedridden for about two hours (once we arrived).
I would not underestimate it.
The waves were only about 10-12 feet high, but  they were vertical because the current would take the bottom off of them. They did not break on us, but we would fall down the surface of them. The stern would get pushed 20 feet leeward with every wave we traversed.
Minimize risk?- well if I were going to sail across in a small boat- I would trust the weather report, and not go until I had a 24 hour window of good winds. I think a small boat could make it to Alice town in 12 hours if you averaged about 4-5kts hour.

[Auspicious]

I now question common knowledge and other examples of "everyone knows."

I cannot comment from personal experience about the Stream in northerly winds, but Grog for that statement.

Thank you my friend. <grin>

I crossed the gulf stream in 20-25 knot northerlies from Miami to Bimini.

That's exactly the kind of personal account I was looking for. Thank you, with a nip of grog for your seasickness. It's good to have credible data.

Anybody else with experience in the Stream in adverse conditions?

sail fast, dave

[CharlieJ]

I can tell you for an absolute fact that a friend of mine spent 30 miserable hours crossing from the Bahamas back to Florida when the winds were northerly at around 25 to 30. Because the boat owner "had to get back". My friend was the ONLY one aboard not totally incapacitated from sea sickness ( and he was close to it).

Another friend was aboard a 110 foot minesweeper running north in the stream when they got caught. He said he thought he was gonna die.

Crossing the Gulf Stream in a northerly blow is one of those things that the Florida folks will tell you for certain NOT to try. The saying is- "when the elephants are marching, stay inside" referring to being able to see the lumps offshore in the stream.

One bit of wisdom I truly believe and will heed.

[CapnK]

Been out there in powerboats where the wind came up from basically calm to 10-15 NE, and I can tell you it starts getting wobbly right away...

...and when that starts, all the boats under 32-35' begin heading in hasta pronto. The big ones (up to 60' plus) don't stay out much longer than another hour or two. The conditions spiral down too fast.

From land you can watch the buoy reports when a front passes over, and sometimes see how sudden and extreme a change it makes. Basically, fishermen here - and these are guys who can be out or back in 2-3 hours - won't bother poking their noses out of the jetty if the winds are 20+ and northerly. It might not be bad near-shore, but out there...? Nah, you don't wanna go there. ;)

[Auspicious]

Been out there in powerboats where the wind came up from basically calm to 10-15 NE, and I can tell you it starts getting wobbly right away...

Was that in Florida or further North where you are? Doesn't the Gulf Stream spread, sink, and slow further North? When I crossed from Bermuda the GS didn't seem all that significant (very light winds -- the current set was pretty minor though).

See http://rads.tudelft.nl/gulfstream/

sail fast, dave

[Lynx]

Here is NOAA's weather buoy -
http://www.ndbc.noaa.gov/station_page.php?station=41009

Click on history and pick a good wind speed. Put it into one of the sailing games and try it out. Steep, tall and quick.

Don't do it in winds above constant 8 mph or above and you will also need 24 hrs for the seas to calm down from the last winds.

When I crossed over to Bimini last time we had light winds from the West and then clocked north to 20+ from the east 12 miles from Bimini.

The light winds was not bad but 20+ on the nose was a bit rough. I am glad I had an autopilot.

There is a lot of people who bring their boats down after Thanksgiving and fly home for the holidays and then return. Usually a better crossing than in Jan or Feb and warmer weather.

Whenever you cross, you do not want to do it with any north winds above 8 mph for the last 24 hrs.

[CapnK]

Dave - my personal experience was/is off the coast here, but as far as I know the same cautions pertain to pretty much all of the waters along the SE facing coasts of the Carolinas (ie Georgia to Hatteras).

The coastline here is a very shallow, gently-sloping bench right out to the edge of the continental shelf. That also happens to be the edge of the Gulf Stream. Water depths there (going from memory and generalizing) will go from say 150' to over 600' (& deeper) in a mile or two, and the edge of the Stream is clearly visible to the naked eye most days. It is still a pretty tight and coherent formation in the area of the Carolinas.

[CapnK]

This is (or will be) somewhat of an Archive thread, and Scoot discussion gets more specific now that it has it's own section of the Forum to play in... :)

[newt]

Thank you for the Grog (hic!) It seems like the discussion is whether it is safer to go down to Miami and make the quick sail across or to try and sail the stream just out of the Carolina's where it may be wider, but maybe more gentle. The northern route may have additional advantages:(warning- the below is an opinion of someone who has not done the journey)
1- once you cross the stream there apparently are some back eddies above Grand Bahama.
2. The current on the charts is apparently less, but wider of course.
I would like to hear more from sailors that have done this upper route, esp. in smaller boats.

Some people even advocate going to Bermuda before San Salvador.  It gets you around the gulf stream and makes  the winds a little more to your liking. ;D

I'd be up for it, but then again get me talking about sailing and there isn't too much I am not up for...

[ronc98]

This fits my time frame pretty well.  I think by 2010 that gives me more time to prepare for this.   I also like the idea of sailing down the coast first.  It gets me in the water first so saves on gas and gets me in the water sooner. 

How many of you are thinking of single handing this? 

[Godot]

I'm going to single hand it.  That's an important part of the challenge for me.

The route is, of course, completely your choice.  For me, the second most important part of the challenge is the offshore voyage.  I personally have no interest in spending any more time than necessary in the ditch, and intend on heading out of Beaufort and across the stream at the first reasonable weather window.

I may take crew on the return trip.

[ronc98]

This is a very interesting trip for me because it kills two birds with one stone, I would love to sail down the east coast and to top if off with a stop at the islands, perfect.  I like the fact that there are others there to share the fun and perhaps recover the body.      ;D

The biggest problem for me is the amount of time I will be able to be away from home.  I can be gone for a month rather easy anything longer then that and it starts getting a bit more difficult. 

I guess I could always crew if someone needed crew but i would much rather do this myself.

[CapnK]

I would say that the odds, and history ;D, favor me doing the Scoot singlehanded.

Ron - Adam and I talked about how he (or anyone traveling a long way to get to...) would be getting his boat to Beaufort. It could be done in stages, which could also work well as short 'shakedown' cruises for the eventual long offshore leg.

Ie; Move the boat some distance over a long weekend well ahead of time, leave it somewhere for a bit, repeat as needed to be able to get to Beaufort in late April, if you want to begin your Scoot when it looks like several others will be starting theirs...

And, BTW, anyone wishing to do this that will be coming up from the south is invited to leave the boat here in Georgetown, and I'll keep an eye on her for you in the 'between' times. :) G-town is approx 3 fairly long days to Beaufort by ICW, 2 sailing days outside, if the weather cooperates.

[Captain Smollett]

Good point, Kurt, and again this emphasizes just how good a Start point Beaufort really is. 

There are multiple good, well protected anchorages in the Beaufort area, so if one even needed to move their boat there a month or two in advance, leaving her there should be relatively stress free (compared to some areas) and inexpensive (compared to marinas).

I may have more comment on this in a few weeks.

In addition, there are quite a few quality anchorages/harbors along the Neuse River, only a few hours north of Beaufort.  For those more inclined to leave their boat in a marina, along the Neuse they run as little as $6 per ft per month, though some of them (as you can imagine) are full and have waiting lists.

[Marc]

My plan is to leave Iowa about 3 days before the start, a day to drive out, a day to get aquanted with the area and get ready, meet all of you guys and probably drink some grog, and then go!  This gulfstream thing has me concerned though.  Marc

[ronc98]

How are you coming from Iowa Marc?  I will be coming from ohio and perhaps if the route is close to the same we can follow one another.   

I am not so affraid of the gulf stream I am more affraid of the trip trailoring my boat there.  I figure if I make it that far the rest is easy.

[Pappy Jack]

Marc and Ronc,

I to will be leaving Iowa three, or more likely four days before the start. It's 1300+ miles from Decorah to Beaufort and will take two days of driving. When I was younger I could have done it nonstop but now... it takes a little longer ::). I'm sure that I could meet up with you two some where along the way.

Fair winds,

Pappy Jack

P.S. Marc, are you getting my emails?

[Marc]

Pappy Jack and RonC,  My next door neighbor is originally from N.C. said that it's about a 22 hour drive from Des Moines to the East coast,  Pappy Jack I received 1 email from you as a PM here on this site but none in my email account.  Ron C just hook her up and go make sure everything works and you should have no problem getting there.  I have not selected a route yet maybe through Chicago or St. Louis.  Marc

[AdriftAtSea]

I'd avoid Chicago as much as possible.  The area around chicago isn't all that trailer friendly, since they have a lot of toll roads.  Cutting southeast is probably a much better bet IMHO.  I had to travel through the area with a trailer when I was taking Gee from DC to Seattle.

I'd go I-80E to I-74E to I-75S to I-64E.  From I-64E you have a couple of choices, but I'd probably take I-77S to I-40E.  Be aware that parts of I-64E and I-77S are toll roads.

Once you're on I-40e, you can either get off at NC-24 and take it east to Beaufort, or continue further  a bit further south/east on I-40e and take NC-53 to NC-24.  The NC-24 route is a bit more direct, but I don't know how slow a road NC-24 is, so taking I-40e and then cutting across using NC-53 might be a better choice.

[ronc98]

You know in the future a SCOOT across the great lakes would be good.