More boat opinions wanted

Tim · October 16, 2009, 01:07:34 PM

Oh we are playing lowball here! ;D

Last year after Mary and I spent 2 weeks on our 18' 6" Potter we BOTH said we were ready for another couple.

s/v Faith · October 16, 2009, 01:30:29 PM

"Gentlemen do not sail to weather". ;D

Two adults AND an 80# lab for 9 months...

...and all I can think about it getting BACK out there. !

Christopher · October 16, 2009, 01:53:40 PM

Quote from: Lynx on October 16, 2009, 06:20:11 AM
Thanks, Any boat you have mentioned will handle that if in good shape. I do not htink that you can steer into that kind of wind and seas for 200 miles singlehanded. I have handled those kind of seas in my boat but I have an auto pilot and I do not have enough fuel for 200 miles in those concitions.

3 people on a boat for a week is fun. Any boat will be close spaces. The smaller and lighter will be rougher. The bigger and heaver will be more expensive and harder to handle because of the increased size, A little late in the season, but I suggest that you try to handle the sails in a blow by yourself and up the anchor in a blow by yourself on the bigger boat your wife to. When I crossed to the Bahamas the wind and seas was to rough for my buddy boat's wife to sear more than 1/2 hr in the 10 hr crossing.

Wherever from and whatever I sail home with, I'll be bringing one or two friends along for the return trip. One guy in particular has a lot of experience and so I'll bring him along as I know there are plenty of things I haven't yet run into. Literally... :)

What I've found in my reading, and from at least one of the replies here is that Irwins and Ericsons are not boats built to high-quality construction standards...

To Summarize boats of sound construction then:
Cals and Tartans are a maybe among the more modern designs and of course all those so frequently discussed on the forum here...

Lynx · October 16, 2009, 09:49:31 PM

There is 2 books to read.
20 small boats that you can take any where
20 - 30 foot boats (or something like that) you can take anywhere.

The problem that you will run into is yo do not know what has happened to the boat and you do not want to replace everythiing.

Have fun.

nowell · October 19, 2009, 01:14:23 PM

Check out the Grampian's. They got a really good review, a decent following, lots of space in the cabin, 6' headroom, and they are pretty reasonable price wise. GOB did a review on them not long ago, and they were listed as a capable pocket cruiser. Also Canadian built, so I would imagine a decent ammount up in your neck of the woods.

Frank · October 19, 2009, 08:01:37 PM

Nowell...good call. They are great bang for the buck. Lots of headroom and a huge cockpit. They are setup nice for OB's as well. There are a 3 of them locally.Seem to be standing the test of time pretty well. A bit dated looking but a lotta boat for $5-$6000.

nowell · October 20, 2009, 09:30:47 AM

Quote from: Frank on October 19, 2009, 08:01:37 PM
Nowell...good call. They are great bang for the buck. Lots of headroom and a huge cockpit. They are setup nice for OB's as well. There are a 3 of them locally.Seem to be standing the test of time pretty well. A bit dated looking but a lotta boat for $5-$6000.

Nice! I recall they had a decent production run, so I would imagine you could even get a bit competitive on those prices! I think its still a sharp looking boat, with a bit of 'spit n polish' I bet it could have a very nice classic boat look! Didn't they also have a swing keel version, or something along those lines?

Christopher · October 20, 2009, 10:02:35 AM

Cool -- this is just the kind of information I was looking for. There are so many manufacturers out there and it's hard to know the run of the mill slapped together boats from the quality built ones.

Here's a nice looking Gramp 30 from my hometown.
http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1976/Grampian-30-2114911/Green-Bay/WI/United-States

Can't tell from the pics but it looks like a standard spade rudder.

I'll have to find the review on these boats from GOB.

Thanks nowell!

Christopher · October 20, 2009, 11:11:34 AM

Setup to go see a Bristol 29 next week. Want to get aboard before the decks freeze! Dinette layout which I'm not crazy about but all the other aspects are enough to tempt me to drive 2 hours to see her.

I'm actually getting a little sick of looking at these things... Last week took out a CD 25 for a test sail... The PO was a heck of a nice guy and the boat was in nice shape, but the 25 is just way too cramped for me and the sails and outboard were original (over 30 years old)... Surprised at how light the standing rigging was. The spreaders looked like they were just being held in place by the shrouds and not securely fastened to the mast... Boat sailed beautifully in some strong winds and confused seas coming off a nearby seawall.

nowell · October 20, 2009, 12:56:06 PM

Nice find. Im honestly torn between the inboard and outboard. As you know I have mine pulled from my Vega. Im still contemplating a Beta replacement, but there are so many pros and cons between that and the OB I currently have. Not going to get into that here. Grampian makes some in the sub 30 foot range that I actually like how they do the outboard placement. Thats a nice looking 30 tho for sure! I mean, look at that cockpit! Talk about great for entertainment!

Anyway, im getting side tracked. Another one you might want to consider (that I actually tried looking for for awhile) is the Eastward Ho. Again, this is fuzzy memory from reading somewhere, but they were New England produced boat I think? Akin to the Dana 24, Flicka, etc, nice wide beam, very solid. Won't get you anywhere fast, but supposed to be a little tank. Think they were all in the 24 foot range, with a head, so would be great for single handing with the occasional companion. I think even some had a 1 or 2 horse diesel in them?

Im sure Frank will check his memory banks and throw something up! ;D

skylark · October 20, 2009, 01:14:34 PM

I'm not a fan of Grampians. I think they have a decent hull shape but were put together poorly. They are very cheap to buy, though.

nowell · October 20, 2009, 01:42:18 PM

Don't know about put together poorly (sorry not trying to start anything, just trying to understand where your coming from, or what im missing), but I would most definately take one of those to the far ends of the earth over the Irwin or Ericson asked about earlier.

I've only every been on one, and that was just at the marina, so can't say for how they sail? Maybe im missing something?

Christopher · October 20, 2009, 02:20:37 PM

I have read that the company underwent a change in philosophy around 1970. I think it was on sailnet someone said that the 60's variety of Grampians were very well built, but after 1970 or so, they began targeting a more budget boat strategy... this might account for the diverging opinions... But, this was just another forum post on sailnet. I'll just keep goin through em and seeing what I like and don't like.

Still wish that refit Triton that sold out of Chicago last year would have come up for sale this year... that thing got snatched up in a hurry!

s/v Faith · October 20, 2009, 03:22:05 PM

FWIW,

I used to crew on a wooden interior Grampian 26. It was a well made boat. I did not like the keel / rudder for a boat I would own (my preference is a full keel) but it sailed well, had a very roomy interior and was a great pocket cruiser.

I would take it over many more modern production boats.

Frank · October 20, 2009, 07:05:45 PM

The 26 did come in a swing keel as well.The long fin was 4ft 3in draft.They are relatively stiff boats. The OB simply attached to a cutout at the aft end of the cockpit.Very handy and on the centerline (not out of the water on the wrong tack' They were not high end boats. Sturdy built...just not fancy. I saw one about 6-7 yrs ago that had been extremely well restored and upgraded by its owner.They really do 'clean up nice'
Grampian 26

Specifications:

L.O.A.: 26' 0" (7.92 m)
L.W.L.: 21' 9" (6.93 m)
Beam: 8' 4" (2.54 m)
Draft: (fin) 4' 3" (1.29 m)

Displacement: 5600 lbs. (2540 kg.)
Ballast: 2600 lbs. (1179 kg.)
Sail area: 325 sq. ft. (30.19 m²)

Motor: usually 9.9 hp outboard.
Headroom: 6' 0" (1.83 m)
Berths: 4 to 5
Rating (PHRF-LO) : 213

Christopher · October 21, 2009, 10:57:18 AM

Thanks everyone for all the information...

This site is a great resource for someone in my position. Hopefully next summer I'll have some posts and pics of a Great Lakes cruise or two...

Still looking for pictures when I'm up at my parents of a boat I "tried" building when I was a kid. It was as beamy as it was long, built of 2x4's and 1/2 plywood left over from the screen porch project I worked on with my dad through the spring. Never got it to the water because it weighed too much to even get up on a trailer :)

s/v Faith · October 21, 2009, 11:30:23 AM

Chris,

All of this will pay off when you find 'the boat'. Thanks for letting us be a part. ;D

I built one of those boats too.

More barge like then anything, I am still amazed that my dad agreed to put it on top of the car and drive it down to the bay... there is a tidal pond on the flats below Corte Madera that she was launched in.

She had a linen sail, a big rudder (like a 4' deep teardrop) a 2x2 mast and was rigged with Jute twine. The largest weakness was the fact that her seams were caulked with window spakle... she shipped water so fast she went down nearly as fast as she went forward.... :P

She was so heavy filled with water (nothing to bail with) that I could not pull her out of the soft mud. For at least 3 years we watched as she turned up on various banks after storms. :D

After that, I settled on full keel boats. ;D

Christopher · October 21, 2009, 03:57:52 PM

Quote from: s/v Faith on October 21, 2009, 11:30:23 AM
I built one of those boats too.

More barge like then anything, I am still amazed that my dad agreed to put it on top of the car and drive it down to the bay... there is a tidal pond on the flats below Corte Madera that she was launched in.

She had a linen sail, a big rudder (like a 4' deep teardrop) a 2x2 mast and was rigged with Jute twine. The largest weakness was the fact that her seams were caulked with window spakle... she shipped water so fast she went down nearly as fast as she went forward.... :P

She was so heavy filled with water (nothing to bail with) that I could not pull her out of the soft mud. For at least 3 years we watched as she turned up on various banks after storms. :D

After that, I settled on full keel boats. ;D

At least you got her to the water! Hilarious that you'd see her reappear... Did you name your vessel?

I had built the hull from 1/2" plywood and had no skills in bending so the hull was quite angular, much less ridiculously heavy. She was about 8' long and had to be close to 6' wide... would have made a good party barge if it weren't for the fact that it probably would not have floated.

Cpt2Be · October 22, 2009, 02:33:26 PM

I have been looking at that Bristol 29 myself.

This one...

http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1967/Bristol-Herrshoff-29-1947190/Door-County/WI/United-States

and this one

http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1970/Bristol-29-2094522/Manitowoc/WI/United-States

Which one did you look at and how did she fare?

Still less of a likelyhood as transport is still prohibitive but they both seem well maintained and well priced.

We have until Feb/Mch before we start having Surveys done and start bidding and those are both possibilities if I can work out some way to transport that fits our budget.

Let me know what you gleaned from your visit, that is if you're no longer interested in it, don't want to end up in a bidding war and drive up cost for you.

Christopher · October 22, 2009, 09:20:26 PM

I haven't gone to look yet. I'm heading up to Manitowoc on Monday to go see the '70. We shall see!

Sellers are kind of at bay right now with winter storage, so it gives us time to scour :)

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More boat opinions wanted