Power: Solar, wind, lights, towed....???

[Captain Smollett]

Shouldn't be much of an issue. I'm willing to be that your outboard would run just fine on a 40:1 mix.

I don't know what kind of ob this is, but I do know that in every model of Johnson that I have read Manufacturer's Shop Manuals for, they specifically recommend AGAINST doing this kind of thing - even just a little bit.

For what it's worth...

[CapnK]

Craig/Faith is a certifi(able ;)) outboard mechanic (Yamaha?), and he told me that the leaner oil/fuel mixes were mostly due to EPA mandates WRT what was coming out of the engine post-combustion, that running an o/b richer with oil (to a degree, of course) is actually *better* for the outboard in the long haul.

IIRC, of course. Maybe he'll put us straight on this, but the only issue that I think it might cause is fouling plugs a bit more/frequently, and I don't think that little bit would make too much difference.

(How unequivocal is THIS post? ;D )

[AdriftAtSea]

CapnK?

That was my understanding as well.  And having it a little richer in oil strikes me as a far better option than having it too low in oil.  One will damage the engine permanently, the other will not.

[s/v Faith]

A couple of points before Dan makes his 3000th post.. Yea Dan!  ;D

I was on the boat for 6 weeks last fall. I have 4 golf carts and 2 -130watt panels......snow is melting

  Wow, I can hardly fit a dingy onboard... 4 golf carts?  Really?  Wow!  That is really something!   ;)

I was a Yamaha/Honda motorcycle & ATV mechanic in the 80's, we worked on pretty much everything Yamaha made other then the musical equipment.  Our training was done in modules, and I recall the tech rep teaching us about the evils of alcohol in fuel... in 1985. He also told us that the Yamaha 2 strokes were going from 50:1 to 100:1 . but that we could / should continue to run them at 50:1.  IIRC, the jets were changed to run a bit richer when they went to 100:1 to allow more of the fuel with less oil to get into the motor.  IIRC the tech rep said fuel mixed 100:1 was only good for something silly like 45 days!

  If anyone here have ever messed with British seagulls, you know that some motors can run on 20:1, or you can change the jet and needle and run it on 32:1.

  Keep in mind there are 4 considerations, really 5, that come into play with a 2 stroke motor.  The oil not only lubricates the 1.) top end, it also 2.) lubricates the lower end and 3.) increases the octane of the fuel, all while 4.) changing the damping of the reed valve(s). and last but far from least you are 5. Changing the flow characteristics of the the motor... the volumetric efficiency, the scavenging port utilization, even the exhaust efficiency (especially when unburnt oil builds up).

  Wow, all that from Sonny Meyers (Team Yamaha tuner back in early 70's) port and polish lessons from my youth....  ;D

[AdriftAtSea]

I'm trying to figure out where he stashed the two 130 watt panels.  I've got two on my boat, but my boat is 18' wide...

[Mr. Fixit]

The two solar panels are on a hard dodger--I think I posted a picture of this set up. The 4 golf carts are located in the same place that the trans for the atomic 4 was located. I gained a lot of room by converting to a Volvo and saildrive. They fit under the steps to the cockpit

[Captain Smollett]

If so a http://Kyocera Solar KD-135 135 Watt 12 Volt Solar Electric Panel[/img] ($415 which is a steal) mounted on the stern rail

.....

Man, this was SUCH a great deal I just can't pass it up.  I just ordered one, and would recommend anyone looking for  a panel to consider doing the same.  Last time I priced these panels they were ~$700!

Craig,

I'm thinking of getting a Kyocera 85 W for about $335.  One thing that was giving me pause was the glass top vice polymer...'crash' resistance.

I know one person here with one and he's had no trouble with it mounted on his fore hatch (an accident prone place, I'd think).  I was planning to put in off the stern rail, so figure it would be safer.

But, in keeping with the advice earlier in this thread (which I just re-read from the beginning to brush up), are you happy with your experience with the Kyocera panels?  Is yours, in fact, a glass topper?

Thanks.

Also, I just priced the Link 10 Monitor.   :o :o :o

The Morningside SunSaver Duo is both controller and monitor for about $130, so that's what I'm looking at now.  The monitor only draws 8 mA when the screen light is off (and I MIGHT put a switch in to turn it off completely...don't know if it's worth the hassle though).

[Grime]

This company has a 130 watt 12 volt for $260.00   I have one of their smaller one and very happy with it.

http://www.solarblvd.com/

[s/v Faith]

John,

  The reason Kyocera uses glass is because there are no better options (yet).  Polymers break down over time with UV exposure, and Kyocera plans to have their panels working years after many will have failed.

  The glass can break, but is pretty hardy.  Many folks have used them for many years without a problem.  Kyocera
is good gear, but others may well work out equally well for you. 

  I installed a Morningstar controller on the 424 I was delivering, and it is highly recommended.  I looked at the Flexcharge for that install, but they seem to have gotten way too proud of them... for the price I would not go that way again... but probably go with the morningstar.  Have no experience with the monitor / regulator combo you linked to.

[Captain Smollett]

John,

  The reason Kyocera uses glass is because there are no better options (yet).  Polymers break down over time with UV exposure, and Kyocera plans to have their panels working years after many will have failed.

  The glass can break, but is pretty hardy.  Many folks have used them for many years without a problem.  Kyocera
is good gear, but others may well work out equally well for you. 

Thanks for the info.  I thought Kyocera was good stuff, and I like that the glass toppers have higher efficiencies.

Just wanted to see if you had either any problems or reservations about recommending them.

  I installed a Morningstar controller on the 424 I was delivering, and it is highly recommended.  I looked at the Flexcharge for that install, but they seem to have gotten way too proud of them... for the price I would not go that way again... but probably go with the morningstar.  Have no experience with the monitor / regulator combo you linked to.

I'm fairly confident that the internals of the controller I am looking at are the same (or the same enough) as the other Morningstars in use by various sailfarers.

I like the idea of a monitor on the electrical panel since I can give a crew member the daily job of checking the battery status.  I know it seems like an expensive toy for that purpose (beyond the practical of knowing what system state), but finding useful things for them to do REALLY helps the sanity of all aboard.

Right now I have one 'assigned' to daily wx forecast (which is not done daily, but we'll get there  :) ), and a suitably important task for t'other seems appropriate.

Besides, I don't want to have to dig into the battery bay with a DMM to check charge states before doing things like charging the laptop or batteries for the GPS....so, the monitor will come in handy. 

At first, wanting it seemed like a big step away from KISS, but KISS seems like a continuum of complexity vs utility.  I still ain't getting a water maker or pump for running water in the galley, and tonight at dinner, the Mate and I had a long discussion on the pros and cons of getting an Engel or not (battery and charging capacity being a big con, btw).

Anyway, again, thanks for the input.  It's too easy to get paralyzed on a major purchase like a solar panel.

[Tim]

I think having a monitor part of the controller is a great addition. I have a Morningstar for the Ariel, but just a controller.

I put a monitor on the RV and it really helped me keep track of the batteries. It had a small solar panel and would primarily get charged by the engine unless we would stay put for a few days and that when it would really help.

I am putting a little electrical on the Typhoon with only a 5 watt panel to keep it charged, I will probably check it with the monitor (it's portable) to see how well it keeps up.

[s/v Faith]

The battery monitor may be a departure from KISS, but it is (IMHO) a worthy one.

I REALLY like having my LInk 10... I don't have to think about the charge level much at all.... I have voltage, instant current use, cumulative current use / input and even a charge percentage at a glance.

  It IS an instrument, but it is worth having.  It may be significant that if it fails, it still has no impact on the system other then the fact that it will not work.