SAR ops....

[w00dy]

The Nina is lost somewhere on the Tasman sea. The families of the crew are upset at perceived mismanagement of  the SAR ops by various government entities. Do they have a right to be critical?

http://sailingsavoirfaire.blogspot.com/2013/08/apathy-from-us-officials-put-at-risk.html

[rorik]

It is sad that a beautiful boat and 7 people are missing.
Do the families have a right to be distraught and do anything they can to find find their loved ones? Absolutely.
But do sailors, or their loved ones waiting for them to return, from any country, in any size boat, have the right to expect to be rescued, costs be damned? I think not.
Each of us are responsible for our own lives - sometimes it ends badly.
As to the families claim that if there were a "catastrophic failure" there would be signs of that failure - not necessarily.
Over the centuries, many boats and ships, some much larger than the Nina, have vanished without a trace.

[w00dy]

I agree mostly. The interesting thing about this story is that after searching for 12 days and giving up, the New Zealand SAR crew sent some information about a debris field to the families and suggested using drift modeling software to backtrack a position. The families were basically asking the Coast Gu ard to run some numbers on a computer program for an hour or so, and instead of help, kept getting the run around from various state depts.

There's a high probability that she sank immediately and will not be found. While it can be expensive to keep any boat in seaworthy condition, you would need a small army/fortune to keep up an old wooden schooner. Still, if she is floating somewhere, the drift modeling software could allow the SAR to narrow down an area the size of the Gulf of Mexico into a few smaller locations feasibly searched. As the families are bearing the cost of the operation now, why shouldn't the Coast Guard help them out? They seem to be frustrated that their loved ones might be dying as they are getting useless form letters from various officials.

I can understand calling off a search as the costs add up, but it must be frustrating to get blown off by one government agency after another. It's not like worthless bureaucrats getting in the way of effective action is a new thing, is it?

Read page 25 of the article, specifically, and see what you think.

[marujo_sortudo]

I'm always sad when a boat is lost a sea, but the perceived right to SAR blows my mind.  Ocean SAR is an unbelievable luxury to me in a world where most of us don't even have access to clean drinking water.  Those of us that can own a boat and go adventuring for pleasure are a lucky few.  Though we have concerns for the potential loss of life, the number of lives lost are tiny compared to many other activities.  I do hope (though doubt) for a safe return of the Nina crew.  Still, I think we should regard the availability of SAR services as a great privilege neither to feel entitled to or to be depended upon.  YMMV.

[rorik]

I read all of the article before my first post.
Drift modeling has to be be available somewhere other than the USCG. Marine biologists, climate scientists, etc.
Maybe I'm just getting old and bitter, or maybe I'm fed up with people demanding that government come to their rescue for every mishap - great or small - regardless of the cost to everyone else.
If life were without risks any greater than getting your feelings hurt, not only would no one ever learn anything but life would be pretty flippin' pointless to boot.
I'm not trying to be mean to the Nina's crew or their families, although it probably sounds that way to those who don't know me very well.
We all die.
If the Nina's crew died doing something they loved - as tragic as that is - they're ages ahead of 99% of the people on this planet.


...and a grog to marujo...

[w00dy]

I agree with you, Rorik. I'm in favor of personal responsibility and self-reliance. Criticism and opinions are just wind. The reality is something else, which the Nina, and the rest of us will have to live and die by. As a sailor, I accept that. Eventually, the families will have to as well. It must be frustrating for them right now, trying to come to grips with that, espcecially in light of evidence that might have narrowed their search and given closure.

I'm usually not one for religious statements, but...

God bless the Nina, and us all.

[s/v Faith]

I have been a defender of Nina on another site.  Since the beginning I have tried to defend the captain and crew from the legions of armchair sailors and pundits....  Some with valid perspectives.... Others with less then.

I held out hope for them for a long time, but doubt they are still working their way home now.  :(

What has been heartbreaking has been to listen to some of the comments the spectators have been making from their couches.... Especially since the family members have been participating in the discussions. 

The bottom line is the EPIRB was apparently not set off.  I respect the captain, and my theory was that his ship was still underway some time after the last communication was received.  For those who have not been following this closely they were sailing in the southern ocean in winter... One of the least hospitable places for a small boat on the planet.  The last communication was a sat phone based message that said they had shredded storm sails but were underway. 

I suspect that the captain knew that he was going to set a chain of events in motion that would result in his ship being lost and lives being risked once he pushed the big red button.

The same group of people who recently shredded another captain who choose to ask for rescue have also shredded this guy for not making that choice.  Of course THEY would always make the right decision...l from the comfort of the couch, the view is much more clear.  ::)

So if I am right, and the captain was limping his ship back under her own (reduced) capability and the southern ocean struck again.

Much has been made of the fact that as large as she was, Nina was very much a sailfar boat.  She had a spot, a sat phone, and an EPIRB.  I can tell you that all three either do not work or do not work well below decks,,,,  they were likely on deck and could have been damaged or lost in rough seas.

Had the EPIRB been activated earlier, the SAR efforts might have been successful.  The captain made a decision to try to sail his ship and the sea / weather did not cooperate.

[s/v necessity]

It seems to me we might be getting distracted by a few straw men.

My understanding is that the family is attempting to perform a privately funded search (i.e. is not demanding further tax payer funded searching)  However, they simply want timely access to information regarding what search has already been performed.  (In other words they want the bureaucrats to share information with them, and I suspect the bureaucrats are thinking "how will this make us look if they succeed in finding their family???)  They do not want the government to perform a drift analysis, they want the gov't to hand over information critical to performing a privately funded analysis.

[rorik]

It seems to me we might be getting distracted by a few straw men.

You might be right...  :-[

[w00dy]

The search continues:

http://theadvocate.com/home/6833560-125/new-zealand-steps-up-in

[Jim_ME]

Was thinking about the missing SV Nina...wondering if there were any updates on the Search and Rescue effort and found this Facebook website that picks up where earlier articles left off to date...

https://www.facebook.com/ninarescue

[w00dy]

Thanks for sharing. I was also wondering about them the other day. I can understand why they want to keep the search going. I couldn't sleep at night with the thought that my loved ones might be drifting around in a raft and I wasn't searching for them. In all probability they have perished, which is the assumption that SAR must operate on. Still, there's always a chance.