Sailing dingy

[Frank]

Disclaimer:there is NO perfect dingy...

BUT....there can be FUN dingy's 😁

While at anchor yesterday a sweet old (60's) Morgan 34 pulled in. Beautiful lines with its long overhangs!!
It was towing an ugly orange Portaland Pudgy dingy. (They ARE ugly dingy's😄)  Once settled in, they popped in the lil mast, board and rudder and went about sailing around the harbour.....both husband and wife on the lil pudgy!

This isn't about Portland Pudgy's...or inflatables...
The reason I'm posting this is they both looked like they were having a blast!! Those who have been out and know how occasional Boredom (meaning nothing new to fix) sets in will appreciate my envy watching these two grinning like kids sailing the lil boat around.
Couldn't help but think how many times it would be a hoot if a dingy could be sailed. Not thinking fuel saving....strickly the "fun factor"

As ugly as the Pudgy is.....I admit to momentary dingy envy just for the joy of knockin around in a little sailboat.

Has anyone here ever cruised with a dingy that could be sailed?

[CharlieJ]

Raylay and W00dy do- and she used to sail it often in the harbor here while they were doing the rebuild on Mona

[Norman]

I don't know about ugly, as I was in it with Ralay and wOOdy, and in calm water it is a fine dinghy!  On a very cold day, we rowed out to Mona, and I got the grand tour of that fine vessel.

Not too suitable for sailing with the three of us in it, but in warm water, I would not pass up a chance to go sailing in a Pudgy! 

At Bethany Beach, Delaware, I was sailing in the ocean on my Aqua Finn, similar to a Sunfish, and two very young lads came sailing up from the south on a Sunfish, low in the water.  Naturally, I sailed to meet them, and found that they had put in at Ocean City that morning, and were sailing to Atlantic City New Jersey!

Their mini cruiser had a bushel basket lashed to the mast with a plastic bag in it with part of their supplies, and another bushel basket with two inner tubes around it and another plastic bag of gear, at the end of a short tow rope.  They also had two plastic gallon jugs of water to drink.

Their plan was to sleep on the beach, cook over a drift wood fire, and their parents were picking them up in AC the third day!

Even though I was about 50, I very much envied them and their adventure.  When I found that they did not have a compass, simply planned to stay in sight of shore all the way, I gave them some guidance on crossing the Delaware Bay, which is wide enough that if you are down as low as they were, they would be out of sight of land more than half way across.  Even on the ferry, you get out of sight of land for a bit.

My advice was to start in the morning, no matter when they arrived, and basically hold the same wind angle for each "leg" of the trip, and sail toward the ferry when the first saw it each time it came across from New Jersey, and as it sank low going toward NJ.  That way, they would always be correcting toward the ferry route, which is the shortest route across.  That would take care of tidal flow pushing them out to sea, and wind shifts on the voyage across.  They were not aware that they would be out of sight of land, and were very appreciative of the suggestion on safely staying on course.

I did not tell them, but I was sure that the ferry pilots would see them the first crossing, and watch for them each time after that, and be a "mother duck" if they got in trouble!

The problem that they were not taking seriously enough was sunburn, they were in short pants, and no shirts.

Frank, sailing small craft is a hoot, no matter how old you are, I just sold my Aqua Finn 2 year ago.  The difficulty of getting it off the back wall of the house and on the trailer, then the trailer uphill to the driveway, became too much work.

Lets see, now, if I rented a Pudgy in the Bahamas, took two heavy duty plastic garbage bags of clothes and food, maybe a tarp, I could CRUISE!  Just take to the beach when the weather went bad, turn her over and sleep, sheltered from wind and rain.  Do you think the people on the Morgan would rent me their dinghy?

[Frank]

Too funny Norman!!

Yes....nothing more fun than sailing a little boat.
Couldn't help but grin watching them having a blast in the harbour.
Solid may not be as stable as an inflatable but between rowing and especially sailing....much to be said for ability.

[Owly055]

   It seems to me that a sailing dinghy for a cruising sailboat is pretty obvious.   I personally plan to begin construction of my 8' sailing dinghy next month as the weather is finally moderating here.  This will be a two piece nesting version, and will incorporate some water tight compartments.  The centerboard trunk will be forward of the  normal position, placing it in the shorter bow section, and the rig will be a simple junk rig.   It will be a sailboat to play with on small local bodies of water, as well as a platform to experiment with the junk rig on a small scale using cheap materials.   I hope to make a number of over night trips in it next summer.    The idea is that a dinghy on a voyaging sailboat should be more than just a shore shuttle.  It should be a boat that can be used to explore and range out from the "mother ship".   I plan to incorporate some "features" that will make it easy to attach things like float tubes and shelter bows in the future............. an ongoing project.

                                                              H.W.

[Norman]

A two piece dingy makes great sense for a modest size cruising vessel.  One aspect that comes to mind is that with only half as much length to fit on deck, a longer dingy would be acceptable.  Increasing the length and holding the width the same would give much more directional stability, and each foot of deck space would give two feet of dingy.

I have sailed several very short sailboats and 8 feet is very demanding of your full time attention to keep a reasonable wind angle or progress toward a destination.  A 12 footer was much more fun to sail.  It had only 4 feet of beam, compared to 3.5 for the 8 footer, so very easy to row.

Additionally, the longer dingy would allow a less vertical bow, as the floatations reserve would be better, resulting in less tendency to have forward motion stopped when driving into steep waves.  In relatively sheltered waters, the waves tend to be short and steep, making a blunt bow a serious disadvantage.

The amount of floatations that could be built in without seriously impacting the ability to ferry heavy or awkward items increases exponentially with length. On your trial over night sails, that additional space will be very helpful.  With the midsection bulkhead, the two piece form is cargo unfriendly, and with water tight compartments absorbing apace as well, there is not much left without being constantly underfoot.

The 8 footer I sailed had 2 feet of sealed floatations in the stern, and another 1.5 feet in the bow, leaving 4.5 feet of useable space on the floor, with the 18 inch center seat restricting that portion to 1 foot vertical.  Put your feet in there, and not much left.

When sailing, of course, the rear seat is unusable due to the tiller.  Performance of the 8 footer, rigged as a cat, would be about the same as your proposed junk rig, and quite simple to handle.

[Owly055]

Norman:
      Good observation and suggestions all.   I'm probably making the wrong choices for all the wrong reasons.... as usual ;-)    I will say that my intent is to make the water tight compartments accessible for stowage.
     The light weight junk rig is important to me, as I intend to convert a larger sailboat to junk rig......... it's not as neat, light, or compact as the cat rig for a dinghy, but it will give me experience with the rig and help me decide what configurations will work best for me.   I'm not committed long term to junk rig on the dinghy, and in fact when voyaging it may end up with a completely different rig.  It's a dinghy of multiple hats......

     The balance area of the junk rig (forward of the mast), will also enable me to set the centerboard further forward.   If possible, and I haven't built enough mock ups yet, but I would like to put the centerboard trunk just forward of the split bulkhead, and the mast just forward of that, and keep the forward section considerably shorter than the aft section.     
     I have some construction board, and need to work on some scale mock ups.     

                                                                                    H.W.

A two piece dingy makes great sense for a modest size cruising vessel.  One aspect that comes to mind is that with only half as much length to fit on deck, a longer dingy would be acceptable.  Increasing the length and holding the width the same would give much more directional stability, and each foot of deck space would give two feet of dingy.

I have sailed several very short sailboats and 8 feet is very demanding of your full time attention to keep a reasonable wind angle or progress toward a destination.  A 12 footer was much more fun to sail.  It had only 4 feet of beam, compared to 3.5 for the 8 footer, so very easy to row.

Additionally, the longer dingy would allow a less vertical bow, as the floatations reserve would be better, resulting in less tendency to have forward motion stopped when driving into steep waves.  In relatively sheltered waters, the waves tend to be short and steep, making a blunt bow a serious disadvantage.

The amount of floatations that could be built in without seriously impacting the ability to ferry heavy or awkward items increases exponentially with length. On your trial over night sails, that additional space will be very helpful.  With the midsection bulkhead, the two piece form is cargo unfriendly, and with water tight compartments absorbing apace as well, there is not much left without being constantly underfoot.

The 8 footer I sailed had 2 feet of sealed floatations in the stern, and another 1.5 feet in the bow, leaving 4.5 feet of useable space on the floor, with the 18 inch center seat restricting that portion to 1 foot vertical.  Put your feet in there, and not much left.

When sailing, of course, the rear seat is unusable due to the tiller.  Performance of the 8 footer, rigged as a cat, would be about the same as your proposed junk rig, and quite simple to handle.

[CharlieJ]

Making watertight compartments and usable for storage is not that difficult- I replaced foam in my small dinghy with water tight compartments- added only 2 small 6 mm bulkheads. Just use screw in deck plates.

Definitely a good plan

[Norman]

Very nice dingy, Charlie J.

Back to Frank's original post on the Portland Pudgy sailing about the anchorage, and the fun being had by the cruising owners, many referred to my old 16 foot Neptune as a dingy.

It was small, and you had to use space with care, but fun to sail.  Just a foot larger than a Potter 15.

If it were dropped in the Bahamas where Frank is sailing, anyone with good judgement could cruise much as he does.  He stays in port when the weather is bad, watches the forecast continuously and moves to a different port if the one he is in is not sheltered.  Such planning and foresight can make a very small vessel safe and comfortable.

She was small, but well designed, and mine was the best version, with the lead weighted , fiberglass sheathed aluminum  swing keel.  In 25 gusting 35 winds and a one mile fetch, producing 4 foot waves and continuous white caps all around us, we sailed dry.  The wind was on the port beam, unreefed main, a mistake, but too hard to correct when it became obvious, and no jib, we just let the main out until nearly luffing and had all the power we needed for hull speed. Tom trimmed the main sheet, and I kept a continuous eye on the oncoming breakers.  As each wave began to lift us, I put the helm down and climbed over the shoulder of the wave, and pulled back up on the tiller as soon as we tipped across the back of the wave, then we watched as it broke in a welter of foam and spray.  Tom pulled in the sheet as I turned up, then let out as we went over the wave, so we never luffed the sail, but also never had more sail exposed to the wind than we could balance with our weight.  We both had our feet on the lee seat edge, as there was 3 or 4 inches of water on the cockpit sole from the water squirting up the combination drain and keel lift cable pass thru.  We were never on our feet long enough for the water to drain.  Surprisingly, we took no spray on board, and both remained dry.

That morning we had sailed out of a very sheltered anchorage under a bluff with tall trees on top, and were unaware of the amount of wind we were going to find a mere 500 yards later.  The jib was lashed on the fore deck, with slip knots, ready to deploy as soon as we were out in the channel, but we never considered actually using it after we reached the windy open water.  As I said, if we had realized how much wind was out there, we would have reefed the main, but with the reefing lines stored in a plastic box down below, not  a practical option as long as we could control the boat.

We sailed from Kings Landing to Benedict MD, 6 nautical miles, in exactly one hour, with a gentle boost from an ebb tide, just starting as we hoisted sail.

With proper gaskets on the seat hatch and fiberglass companionway panel, so that in the event of a wave filling the cockpit, the interior would remain dry.  The cockpit could be bailed out without any risk of swamping.

Another time, on a bay off Lake Michigan, she rode out a storm on a mooring, with 12 miles of fetch and 5 foot waves coming in.  She pitched and rolled violently, and I was perfectly happy to be on shore, but when the wind abated, and I went out to see how she had done, all was dry in the cabin, and very little water in the bilge.  The hull deck joint had some very minor leaks, concealed by the liner, so the water went straight to the bilge, with out wetting anything in the cabin.

There was a big center cockpit cruiser anchored nearby that rode out the storm 200 yard from the "dingy", and they sailed back and forth wildly, and rolled so much that one of the three on board became sick.  I don't know if I could have been on my little boat and not become sick.

In the Bahamas, such a small vessel, drawing just 9 inches fully loaded, with the keel and rudder up, one option if caught where you did not want to be for a storm, you could just run her into a creek and tie off to some trees or large shrubs.  One of the creeks that I have overnighted in was 6 feet wide and a foot deep at low tide.  I tied off to trees on both banks to keep from finding my self high and dry on one bank or the other when the tide went out.

With two aboard, four water proof boxes went into the cockpit at night, and came back in in the morning.  Solo, they could remain below, but the cooler in the foot well of the cabin made it hard to dress unless it went to the cockpit. 

Yes, even a dingy would be a fun cruiser in the Bahamas!

Thanks, Frank for the great pictures and interesting insights.

[CharlieJ]

Thanks Norman. B and B Minipaw For those who haven't seen it, there is a five part article on the build, start to launch on Duckworks Magazine

http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/13/projects/dinghy2/index1.htm#.WM7_Gme1vUF

[Owly055]

Thanks Norman. B and B Minipaw For those who haven't seen it, there is a five part article on the build, start to launch on Duckworks Magazine

http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/13/projects/dinghy2/index1.htm#.WM7_Gme1vUF

   I looked at the Catspaw 8, and it ranked fairly high in my choices of stitch and glue dinghy designs.   I settled on the crayfish purely for simplicity....... fewer parts to glue together.   The Catspaw 8 uses two separate bottom panels for a deeper V bottom, while the crayfish uses a single bottom panel split at the forward end to allow a V bottom, a fairly minor difference, but I'm trying to keep this both cheap and simple..........  Both use approximately the same amount of material, but I'm not convinced that the deeper V offers any benefit.   This is my first stitch and glue project, and I consider it essentially expendable as all dinghies on yachts should be.  Chance of theft is far lower for a home built plywood dinghy than an inflatable, and such a boat can be highly personalized.     8' is about as large as one wants to go on a 31 foot boat I think.   Small, light, cheap, though plywood at $100 a sheet can hardly be called cheap (5 ply Okume).

                                                                          H.W.

[CharlieJ]

 ;D

Depends on where you are. Here's a PART of one of the two dinghy docks in Marathon. This is two of the four piers

Second pic is part of the OTHER dock- same spot