Boats for Great Lakes, ICW and bahamas...

[s/v necessity]

I started off with a catalina 22, and then gained some experience sailing aboard Pearson Tritons (due to some exceptional kindness and generosity).  And I've always been partial to alberg designed boats.  Probably because, I've also always dreamed of "crossing oceans".  I may have a chance to cruise the summer and or fall, and I've been pondering it.  My project Cape Dory 28 sits in the drive, and It will likely never be completed...  (it's currently a bare hull...)

So as I'm shopping and pondering, it occured to me to get your guys opinions as to what other boats I might consider.  I'm partial to something with outboard power and the cheaper the better  (not cheap as in the free boat that costs more in the long run...  but cheap as in something that gets me out and sailing...)

It seems to me that a "full keel" might be overkill, and might be limiting me in my search. (in quotes because we all know the boats I'm talking about are called full keel, but are not).

Anyone out there care to make the declaration that "any ol 24-30' boat will do!"

When it comes to sailing, I did prefer the way my C-22 sailed, compared to the tritons I've sailed on. However, I suspect the tritons I sailed on could have benefitted from better tuned rigging and sails (i.e. i'm not sure it's a fair contest).  When it comes to getting hit by a gust of wind the pucker factor on the C-22 was incredible....  (more than once it would have clearly gone over if the sheets were not cut loose.)  And I think that's a bit unacceptable....

In any event I'd love to hear some thoughts on what would make a good great loop boat.  I'm wondering if I should be open to beamy boats with unprotected rudders...

[CapnK]

Not many loopers use actual sailing boats, which I say that way because the one book I've read about on the subject, the guy actually says that a mastless centerboard monohull would make a great Great Loop boat. :) Of the many loopers I've met here at the marina, the majority are using trawlers of one sort or another.

Recently I've found out why Dashew likes 'em narrow, shallow, and long, though. I bought a little old fishing boat, she's 14' LOA and a 36" beam, with a bottom rocker as flat as Kansas and 0 deadrise. Think "giant slalom ski". :D I stuck a 9.9 hp motor on her and took her out for the first time a couple weeks ago.
Lemme tell you - 26mph never seemed so fast.  :o  She runs in the teens at half throttle.

For the Loop I think I would look for something with say a 4:1 or 5:1 length/beam ratio, 20-25' LOA, keep it light and minimalistic, so it can be powered with a 25hp motor, cruising economically in the teens. Hopefully you could have some deadrise at the entry to cut down on slamming in small chop, with a long smooth run out aft for easy planing. If it ran like I think it would, I'd think you could plan on burning under 2 gal/hour, making 100+ miles per 7 hour running day, doing the whole trip of 5200+ miles in one season, or 2-3 months. The boat would be cheap enough to run (under $50/day @ $3/gal fuel) and dock that you could plan a marina stay for laundry, weather, or whatever every 4-5 days. Trip cost for fuel and dockage of under $4K...?

You might even be able to stick leeboards and a simple lug rig on such a craft (motor mounted between your twin rudders :) ) and get halfway decent performance off the wind if nothing else.

Then again - a small cat might work really well, using the wind a lot more, a twin sail rig so one could easily raise/lower the mast as needed... :)

[Jim_ME]

The Cape Dory 28 is a fine boat, at 9k displacement about the same as the Alberg 30. They have a strong popularity, and that should help you get a good price for your boat--even as a project boat.

One other important benefit (in addition to seaworthiness) of a relatively heavy/modest beam boat like an Alberg (or Charlie's Rhodes Meridian 25), is a comfortable motion. If you spend time on the boat [at anchor or on a mooring] in a place like Florida the Bahamas, you will likely be trying to sleep on many windy nights, where a good motion will allow you to sleep, and a harsh motion, or worse, pounding will make it difficult or impossible.

Others on this site can vouch for the Alberg Pearson Ariel 26, which is reasonably trailerable.
https://www.triadtrailers.com/triad-trailer-gallery/sailboat-trailers/sailboats-25-30-feet/pearson-commander/

The Alberg Cape Dory 25D is a wonderful boat, but are newer and tend to be much more expensive. They both have the above features, are about 5.2K lbs (base without gear),  and have standing headroom for most people.

Here's some photos of one set up on a nice trailer...
https://www.triadtrailers.com/triad-trailer-gallery/sailboat-trailers/sailboats-25-30-feet/cape-dory-25-d/

If you can forego the standing headroom in the main cabin, I like the George Stadel Cape Dory 25 at 4k lbs and 3 foot draft, or the boat it was adapted from, Stadel's Allied Greenwich 24. I have seen a few Contessa 26 project boats (some with trailers)  for sale at reasonable prices, and these are proven long-distance voyaging boats.

If I were looking for a smaller boat, I like the Cape Dory 22 and possibly the Alberg 22.
https://www.triadtrailers.com/triad-trailer-gallery/sailboat-trailers/triad-trailers-under-24-feet/cape-dory-22/

I have an Alberg Sea Sprite 23, but have not sailed it yet. It has a small very salty looking cabin trunk that offers comfortable sitting headroom for one adult on each side. At 3.5k lbs/7-foot beam/soft bilges, it should have a fairly comfortable motion. I'm thinking that with a Bimini/boom awning that would allow standing at the open companionway to cook, or cooking and lounging in the cockpit. It should be okay, or even good. Am hoping that when cruising, I'll be spending quite a bit of the daytime off the boat exploring the areas that I've cruised to.

I had a CD Typhoon 19 for 12 years and enjoyed that boat immensely. The Sea Sprite seems like what you get when a Typhoon grows up?
I also have an Alberg Bristol Corinthian 19 (1 foot longer LOA and 700 lbs heavier) which now sits on the Triad Typhoon trailer, and towed easily from Rhode Island to Maine. This seems likely to be more of a weekender. Maybe I can up date this to let you know how these boats work out when I start using them--which i hope will be this season.

I like the idea of having a trailer so that if something happens on a long cruise, and I should have to pause for some period of time or cut it short, I can trailer the boat home somewhat easily and affordably. However, the cost of a reliable heavy-duty tow vehicle for boats in the larger end of the range, has gone up a lot in recent years.

Even as I write this, I'm tempted to include boats like the Alberg Bristol 27, Cape Dory 27, and Tartan 27 [...but this is getting into the upper range of trailer-ability and super heavy duty tow vehicles...] 

I reached for project boat(s) that were too big to be comfortably affordable and also need to sell them and get back to ones that I will and did actually use. I now believe that this overreaching and my own slowness to reevaluate and correct course has cost me over ten years of sailing/cruising--all of which seems quite a bit more precious and regrettable now in hindsight than it did when I made the leap. Some situations are so much easier to get into than they are to get out of...

One of the good things about going smaller than you think you may need is that you have more of a buffer financially when the inevitable surprises come along--either in the boat itself, or the economy (pandemics), your job, or in life in general. If you go too big and can only marginally do it, it doesn't take much to push the project and your sailing from the difficult into the impossible. That is a formula to kill the joy that you should experience from owning, maintaining, and sailing/cruising a sailboat. Life is just too short to do that.

That CD 28 is a great boat--for somebody else. Let it go. Get yourself another boat that you will use. Then go sailing. You will never regret that.



(No affiliation with Triad Trailers, except having bought one new for my Typhoon 19 back in 1994. They are good examples of trailers for heavy Alberg-type boats, whether you get one used or modify another trailer to have similar features...)

[s/v necessity]

My CD28 is actually sitting on a Triad trailer, so I know all about those ;)  It's also primarily my wifes boat, and she doesn't seem inclined to let it go.

While shopping around and looking for an appropriate "victim" for the summer, I see that the full keel classic plastics (in the vein of what you have mentioned) are less common than 10 years ago.  Without a doubt they would be my first pick, I'm a fan of those boats.  I'm starting to warm up to the idea of fin keels, and spade rudders. I'm exploring the idea that "perfect is the enemy of good"...  The other day I caught myself looking at a S2 with a centerboard...

[Jim_ME]

My CD28 is actually sitting on a Triad trailer, so I know all about those ;) 

This was a surprise...you already have one.  :o

So where does one find these women?

Okay, from now on I'll include in my personal ad demands:

"Must have Alberg sailboat, preferably 5200 lbs displacement and up, and ideally sitting on a Triad trailer. (and to adapt the joke) Please send photo of sailboat and trailer..."  :D

[s/v necessity]

Be careful what you wish for...

[CharlieJ]

Hey Mark- missed you on the chat last night. As soon as I can get a pic I'll send you a shot of MY SV Necessity. In was going to tell you how she got her name :D

[s/v necessity]

Yeah, It's been a busy week.  I think I was asleep by like 4pm (cause I didn't sleep wednesday night at all!)