What to do about Water? tankage, requirements, watermakers.... etc.

[Leroy - Gulf 29]

DQOTD...  Though my present sailing is on the hard (water too) I'm curious.  Has anyone considered those large laundry detergent jugs?  I kept a few for water storage.  They have a built in spigot and store around 2-3 gallons.  Some are squarish so don't take up as much room as a round one.  Thoughts?

[CapnK]

Capt T - re: sprayer - once you pump it up, it'll spray until the internal pressure goes down to 0 relative. That, and the fact that they spray a nice wide cone of basically mist which really helps conserve, is why I like them so much. I've done some sleuthing around, and found what appears to be a higher quality sprayer than the usual plastic. A bit more expensive, but I plan to get one for testing. My current 1/2 gallon handheld has a small leak somewhere, it won't hold pressure over about 5 minutes, but because it is the small one, it only takes a few pumps to get enough for the chore at hand - whether that's washing dishes or me. :) Also, I think it would be easy to retrofit a spray head of your own liking onto the bigger, hose-equipped sprayers - so if you want a 'thicker, quicker' flow, you could use a common kitchen sprayer handle with little modification.

Leroy - That is an interesting idea. Is it difficult to get the "perfumey" smell out of the bottle, or water that is kept in those? Did you bleach or baking soda them, or something else, to get them non-stinky? :)

[Captain Smollett]

Also, I think it would be easy to retrofit a spray head of your own liking onto the bigger, hose-equipped sprayers - so if you want a 'thicker, quicker' flow, you could use a common kitchen sprayer handle with little modification.

We have three pump-up sprayers: a small 44 oz (or so) hand-held, a 1 gal. and a 2 gal.  The small and largest are the only ones we really use.

The 2 gallon one is an Ortho (so a bit more expensive 'branded' unit) that came with a 12 inch or so stainless 'wand' at the end of the hose.

My initial idea was to remove that metal wand and simply attach the spray head to the hose, but no-joy, at least without a bunch of fiddlin'.

So, the trusty hack saw was used to cut the wand short enough that I could reattach the spray head to it right at the hose-end fitting, and violins!  The sprayer right at the end of the hose.

It's kinda like a poor man's "Shower Massage" and seems to work really well.

Dunno if that's at all related to what you were saying, but it connected in MY mind.    ;)

As for

But don't you still need one hand to actuate to the sprayer?   It seems to me we're right back at the 'jack handle' water pump.  Or have I overlooked the obvious?

Well, silver lining, imo.  That's part of our conservation strategy...that we DON'T run "always on" when washing up for dinner, rinsing, showering, etc.  I personally don't understand the issue with 'can pump with only one hand' that I've heard so much about.  I mean, you pump (or spray) a bit of water into one cupped hand and go from there.

I don't know, I guess it's to some degree personal style.  The four of us manage pretty well with a galley hand pump and "rarely on" pump up sprayers (though they DO have a lock to lock open, we very, very rarely use it...).

If it's easy to "run" the water, it's easy to waste it.  One guy's POV.

[Capt. Tony]

After digesting the info for a bit I've come to the realization that, once again, my choice of words didn't clearly convey the question I had or my train of thought.  I was attempting to contrast the use of srayers and traditional galley pumps with the use of foot operated pumps. 

I think using sprayers is a fantastic idea that promotes water conservation while providing push-of-a-button pressurized water without tapping into the electrical bank.  And the traditional galley pump is a handsome piece of equipment that is nostalgic, simple and elegantly functional, and, is something that I only wish I could afford. 

But more importantly I am that guy who can mysteriously transfer some obnoxious substance from my hand to every imaginable surface and a few utterly impossible spots in a few quick haphazard movements that would for most others be a completly innocuous sequence of events.  It is that realization that warrants a foot-operated or 'hands free' only galley on our boat. 

For the past week or so I have been trying to imagine a fool proof way to convert a srayer to hands free mode without it becoming an unweildly beast that winds up circumventing the K.I.S.S. priciples.  Fortunately I have some time to ponder this concept more thoroughly before it becomes critical to come to a decision.  And there are plenty of good minds here to throw out some ideas. ;D

[Steve Bean]

I haven't done it, but wouldn't it be pretty simple to rig a rod, stick, or string from a foot pedal to the sprayer trigger?  If  the trigger assembly were  clamped firmly in position,   I can envision something workable that wouldn't even approach the "Rube Goldberg" level.

[hearsejr]

 how much water, including drinking, cooking, washing, and emergency supplies, should I carry on board? assuming I'll be in the coastal area but may not be able to find free water, or a place to get get water. I will not have a fixed water tank on the boat for a while, so I'll be using jugs. that's OK with me though.
also will be turning my impossible to reach ice box, that's next to my sink, into a water tank and my old water tank in to a storage area.

[s/v Faith]

Hey Bill,

  I am going to merge this thread into the one on water... lots of wisdom and experience already in there.

If I were not leaving the US, I would say 20 gallons would be a good number for one person... we have tankage / stowage for more since some places in the Bahamas could get tight with limited h2o.

[s/v Monomoy]

Bill, being reasonably (but not overly) conservative, we burn an average of 5 gallons of water per person per day washing dishes, showering, and drinking the water.  That's for typical cruising of a week or less away from a dock with water supply.  If we needed to make a longer run, then we'd certainly cut back on consumption.

[CharlieJ]

Tehani carries 35 gallons in built in tanks, one in the bow and one under the cockpit ( both bladders) and Laura stows probably another 8-9 gallons in jugs here and there. She puts them where needed for trim, or to fill an empty spot so stuff doesn't shift.

We also have the pump up shower full ( 2 gals) when we leave a water supply. And if we KNOW we'll be out for a longer time, we fill two of our collapsible jugs and stow them on the forward end of the cockpit seat, lashed to the stanchion each side.


We figure we can stay out about a month without any problems. Truth is we seldom get into the bow tank, even in the Bahamas. We found water available most every inhabited Cay we visited. Some was a long way away, but available.

We wash dishes in saltwater when the water is clean, then rinse with fresh via the shower. That really extends the usage. We NEVER wash clothes with salt water- takes huge amounts of fresh to rinse out the salt. Also, for clothes that aren't grimy, Laura just uses an ammonia/fresh water solution to wash- then no real rinsing required at all. And no ammonia smell afterwards.

[Oldrig]

Also, for clothes that aren't grimy, Laura just uses an ammonia/fresh water solution to wash- then no real rinsing required at all. And no ammonia smell afterwards.

Charlie,

That sounds like a great idea for washing clothes while cruising.
Thank Laura for the tip!

--Joe

[CharlieJ]

Thanks, but we got the idea from the SSCA forums. Here's a link to a current thread on the subject. We started a long time ago though.

http://forum.ssca.org/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=5183

[hearsejr]

kewl deal.. thanks yall.
I have a messed up bow tank. it's moldy and leaks. it might be a hose leaking under a hidden spot.  I am guessing it holds over 20 gal., and is under the whole v birth. I plan to cut open the tank and clean it out and then I can stack a lot of bottles in there.
I'm also on the Chessi bay, and it is not clean enough for bathing.  it seems no matter how I cut it, I need a lot of water just to cover that during the summer months..when you sweat pours off ya like rain.
  the trouble I'm having is.. for now at least.. I carry those plastic 1 gal. jugs. I am finding it harder every year to find water. it seems like you need to rent a slip and to get the water filled, and then you are not sure if it will be clean enough to drink. the water at my slip has green stuff floating in it. I would like to be able to stay out of a slip for 60 days at a time but it seems water is the biggest issue I am having.
I am looking at getting enough of those store bought water for drinking. maybe if I get some heavy rain storms, I can make a huge funnel and screen, and catch the rain. that would give me a little extra, but you can't count on the rain around here. maybe I can buy the 2oz bottle and stash them all over the small spaces.
the S&R stuff I used to do claims you need a Gal a Day minimum.

  but, if you guys are using an average of 5 gallons of water per person per day ,,,it looks like I'll need a supertanker ! lololol.

I have been using cheap thin paper plates and plastic forks...I reuse the forks for months  until they break... so my dish washing is cups and forks, and a pot. not sure if that helps.
  Thanks for the help. I'll start working on a plan.

[CharlieJ]

We certainly don't use 5 gal per person per day!

I believe that gallon per day figure is for liquids. That would include liquids in cans of veggies, etc. NOT alcohol, which is a diuretic. We figure 1/2 gal of WATER per day, which is pretty close most times. In areas with clean sat water that is. Haven't been on the Chesapeake since the early 80's, but we're heading that way this summer. So we'll see

I'd look into a flex tank to replace the bow one. Vetus and others make heavy duty tanks. Tehani had a built in tank but Laura objected to the taste. SO we put a flex tank in there. No need for a vent and simple to install. We did lose about 2 gallons capacity though. But it's been nice ever since.

And don't bother talking to me about hot. We live on the south coast of Texas remember ;D ;D

[Captain Smollett]

  but, if you guys are using an average of 5 gallons of water per person per day ,,,it looks like I'll need a supertanker ! lololol.

I have been using cheap thin paper plates and plastic forks...I reuse the forks for months  until they break... so my dish washing is cups and forks, and a pot. not sure if that helps.
  Thanks for the help. I'll start working on a plan.

Bill,

Here are some additional "conservation" numbers.  We are a family of four and we use AT MOST 5 gallons TOTAL per day.  That's cooking, drinking and 'showers.'

Dish washing: we use at most two quarts, and that would be a rather big load of dishes.  We usually do dishes once per day, and use a hand held sprayer also.  Used carefully, those sprayers are VERY use efficient.

"Showers:"  We see no need to take a full shower each day.  On the go, we alternate days with sponge bath and shower.  That stretches our water use, too.  For showers, we use an Ortho two gallon pump up sprayer and get at least two person-showers per two gallon tank-up.  With just a little extra care, we could probably stretch that to three showers per two gallon tank.

On the 2 gallon Ortho sprayer, i cut the wand off so the nozzle is essentially right at the end of the hose.  It is essentially a poor mans "shower massage" or similar hand-held shower, with the benefit that is it mostly "off" rather than "on."

[hearsejr]

 Thanks,
  that would help out a lot once I figure out a good technique. lol. I used to take a salt water bath in GA, where the water was cleaner and less muddy. I'd just get a fresh water rinse off and felt great.
I also did some rethinking on my water tank and I believe I have more area then I thought. I now think that I have like 45 + gal. up there.
getting the hoses under the sole replaced might be a problem.
I will get two of the hand pump pressure tanks this week. I'll try to get a couple of 2 gallon ones, but it will depend on what I can find, and how much they cost.
I wouldn't mind getting the 45 gal of fresh water tank back, but I think those bladders will be a little out of my price range.
Charlie...when will you be coming up here?  Call me when you get headed up and I'll meet up with you somewhere. Reedville has the cheapest dockage, $75/mo, but you might have the fish factory smell every few days.  further south there is a cheap dock but it's a tad more expensive.  it's due east on the map of Hampton VA, on the Bay side. the nick name is like Rebel marina, but I'm not sure of the real name. the guy that owns it used to live on a tug boat there. for a 30'er it was $150

[s/v Faith]

I have been saving the bladders out of the boxes of wine for a few months now...

... who was I saving these for again?

[Captain Smollett]

For general purpose use, the hand held (1 liter or 1.5 liter are good sizes) are far more useful.  Don't know why you'd need 2 of the 2 gallon ones. Just a thought...

[Tim]

I have been saving the bladders out of the boxes of wine for a few months now...

... who was I saving these for again?

Dunno, but I know it wasn't Capn K or Frank  ;D

[hearsejr]

hehehehe Craig, I remember someone asking you to save those wine bags..I think someone called dibbs on them like a year ago. lol. I think you had few offers to help get the wine bags empty..lol.

the reason I was going to get 2 of the preasure jugs was because one will fail right when I need it..lol. well that and I could take them ashore and fill them from a garden hose when I find a friendly place who wouldn't mind me stealing a couple of gal of H2O. lol.
I found a one gallon,  jug, but I cann't seem to find anything else. there was small hand hel one at the store down the road but it was way too small to do a lot.

[CharlieJ]

We'll be heading back to Tehani sometime in April. Then cruising at a slow pace towards Annapolis, and Baltimore. Won't be staying any spot for long enough to need a monthly slip, although we will be meeting some friends here and there.

We'll be posting to the Tehani thread as we go, and that shows up here.