OT: Financial rant

[Tim]

WTG

[CapnK]

When I tell my wife that people are living out there simply, cheaply on their own boat she just shakes her head. <snip>

I would do it even if it were more expensive.  8)

Interestingly, today I was told by a fellow geek (who I will be working with to develop a company website for a third party) that the third party told him in a meeting they had today that they liked me, liked my work, and felt good overall about what we will be doing - *except* for the fact that I live on a boat. That apparently was a bit of a concern for the Big Boss.

;D L M A O ;D

Ironically enough, he is supposedly a certified Captain.

??? ::) ??? It takes all kinds, I reckon...  ;)

[AdriftAtSea]

CapnK-

Exactly what does living on a boat have to do with your skills and expertise in developing a website?? AFAIK, the two are completely unrelated.  The Big Boss is a convention bound dinosaur.

[s/v Faith]

........- *except* for the fact that I live on a boat. That apparently was a bit of a concern for the Big Boss......

  Wow!  Sure is a good thing he does not know about your drinking problem.... or your criminal record....  :P



















































;) ;D

[Tim]

ROTFLMAO ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

[Pappy Jack]

Faith.  Man, this is one of the best RANTS I've heard in a long time ;D ;) ;D! Grog on ya man!!! :D ;) :D

Now, if we can only get our government to think this way things might start looking up for our future. Hey, I know... FAITH FOR PRESIDENT :o :o :o!!! Works for me!!!

Fair winds,

Pappy Jack

P.S. Say, isn't Captn. Zen running too?

[s/v Faith]

I went ahead and split this post, and the other posts talking about the utility of credit cards off to; Financing the Cruise  It is a good topic, and is worth reading back through.

Hey Hey Charlie J !
BRAVO!!

"Ya' got ya head on straight Kid!"

My advise to all: Take all of your credit cards (but one never carried, for medical emergency) to the shore of a large body of water. Shred your credit cards with a boat knife, wrap in newspaper, soak with rum, burn at the shoreline. Then scatter the ashes to the sea, followed by a overly generous splash of rum, and invoke the sprite of Neptune to help you sail into life debt free.
Live on a debit card. It works the same way, including a small transfer of money to your savings account, but forces you to stop spending when the balance in your checking account is gone.
Let's face it, you shouldn't be spending more than you make to start with.
If you "need" a credit card to live, then you are a disaster looking for a point in time,  to happen.
I found it difficult at first (following surgery and divorce) until I realized that if I can not pay for something today and buy it anyway, then I am trying to live someone else's life, not mine. Thereby, I devalue myself and become worth less than I was as a person.

[s/v Faith]

One part of Shipscarver's post that really stuck out to me was;

.....I found it difficult at first (following surgery and divorce) until I realized that if I can not pay for something today and buy it anyway, then I am trying to live someone else's life, not mine. Thereby, I devalue myself and become worth less than I was as a person.

  Good stuff.  I think this may well be a big part of the problem with our society... might explain why so many are living like there is something to prove (to other people). 

[Frank]

Great extract on Shipscarver's quote Craig....grog to him...and you for taking it out ;)

[Pappy Jack]

A money guru I subscribe to is Dave Ramsey, author of "The Total Money Make Over" plus a radio show on XM and Sirius satellite radio. Dave is a BIG proponent of cash only and burn the credit cards etc.,etc. Another guru is Robert Kyiosaki, author of the "Rich Dad Poor Dad" series... a very easy read and VERY enlightening ;). If you have any questions about personial finance, I'd go to one of these guys :D

Fair winds,

Pappy Jack

[newt]

I listen to Dave Ramsey too...
Good news guys, we were eating out with another couple when the topic turned to cruising, and  my wife defended the cruising lifestyle! There is hope... ;D
Granted, I want to be doing a lot of things during retirement, but I hope cruising is a big one.

[Seadogg]

I have a little bit of a dilemma that I've been cogitating on for a bit. I know my decision has to be my own, but I'm curious as to what some of my fellow sailors would do.

Recently, when visiting a charter company to check out some possibilities of sailing in a larger boat, the charter company mentioned an ASA course they offer that would include four days of "Live aboard" experience on a boat similar to the size we'd eventually like to get.

Now, I've been sailing for five years and am comfortable on the sloop we own (22 footer). However, my wife would very much like the comfort and confidence that goes along with learning how to sail, of course, from someone who is NOT her husband. Plus, the idea of learning and living on a larger boat is exciting to both of us.

Since sailing is usually "my thing" and not hers, I saw this as a great opportunity to really get her into the groove and set the wheels in motion. I would be taking the course with her. You can always learn new things, right?

Now, my question for you all is this: I have the cash to do the course. The money could also be used for more practical things such as paying off a credit card, paying for my eldest's senior pictures, taking care of some things around the house, etc. You get the picture.

We don't have a ton of money. The $1500 to do the four day ASA course is a lot of cash to us, but, this time around we actually DO have the money.

My wife says it's up to me. She'd love to do the course, but she was thinking next year rather than this year. But, man, you should have seen the excitement when I told her we were penciled in!

So, dear cruisers and wannabes, do I follow the conventional wisdom of working to get out of debt in the hopes of getting closer to the day we can cast off the dock lines? Or do I seize the day and blow the cash on the course?

As I said, I know the decision is mine, but it's fun to get different perspectives.

Fair winds,

Nick

P.S. This would also be our anniversary present to each other.

[Tim]

Nick,

Of course it depends on the company and the instructor, but having done the very thing with my first mate I highly recommend it. It could be the very best $1500 you have spent. I would suggest trying to get references, because a good instructor can make all the difference. Also do not expect complete instruction, you will be required to pre learn a lot in a course like that.

Tim

[David_Old_Jersey]

I have a little bit of a dilemma that I've been cogitating on for a bit.

I would do it  8) (it's always easy spending someone else's money  ;D).

If extended cruising aboard a larger vessel than your own is part of "the dream", even if not forever - then makes sense to see how you get on. and doing so early means you get plenty of time to amend plans if needed or simply will provide reinforcement / encouragement for "your dream". and even more ideas / more dreams  :)

and The fact yer Missus would now jump at the chance should not be discounted - yer never know what is around the corner.......

[Pappy Jack]

Seadogg,

Dave Ramsey, the money guru, would have you get out of debt first :(. Debt and taxes are the two thieves that will steal most of your money and keep you in the poor house. On the other hand, Robert Kyiosaki would  want you to get out of bad debt but cautiously  get into good debt(good debt is debt that somebody else pays for you). Then use the profits from your good debt to buy the fun stuff ;D. Or, you can follow you bliss and take the course. It's all up to you ???.

Fair wind and full sails,

Pappy Jack

[Frank]

I just can't do the 'good debt' thing ???  Back in 1980 I had a morgage and a floating business loan...both most would consider 'good debt'. Then the rates here climbed to over 20%....near broke me! Sold my house,car...bought an old plymouth for $250 and did the 'tremclad paintjob' to survive.Managed to barely hold on to the business..barely...and had the most stressful 5yrs of my life. To me NO debt is 'good debt'...unless it's interest free. Morgages,car payments,credit card payments etc....all add up in INTEREST...money you are paying someone else...money you are working hard for. I just can't see people borrowing huge to have an oversized home...then borrowing for a big car, yet I see it all the time.I've spent most of my life in homes of 900ft or less and currently drive a Toyota Yaris. Maybe I'm cheap...maybe I'm scared...but I AIN"T ever going through another 5yrs like the early 80's again.

[Godot]

It's been awhile since I read rich dad poor dad; but as I recall, he considers a home mortgage as BAD debt, but generally necessary.

One way or another you have to pay for housing.  Either you rent, buy, or live out of your boat; but it costs money regardless.  However, you are very right about people buying too much house.  I know couples (including my in-laws) who live in 4-5000 sq ft, 5-6 bedroom, 3-4 bath houses.  My mother-in-law sometimes calls it a small house.  Go figure.

[Shipscarver]

I have always considered money spent for constructive education/training to be an investment, and as an entertainment expense. But, it was only acceptable if it didn't cause me to demolish my budget.
Last Spring I was very tempted to start in an academic program at a school where I used to teach. But, after careful consideration I felt at this point in my life it would not be a reasonable move. However, the same amount of money to buy a boat was very, very reasonable! ;D  ;)  :D

[Pappy Jack]

Well, Like I said,"It's all up to you." If Kiyosaki's philosophy isn't your thing, then go with Ramsey(get out of debt and stay out of debt). It's also is a very good and safer plan. Most people don't have a plan except "earn it, borrow it, and spend it" then complain that they are "tired of living paycheck to paycheck" ??? :'( . I know of what I speak because I use to be one myself ::).

One thing I learned from Kiyosaki is you spend money on basically two thing, assets and liability's. Assets put money in your pocket and liabilities take money out. It is just that simple. He also says that you have to reduce your risk,when borrowing,  as much as possable.
I've researched other money guru's but picked these two men because what they preach covers just about everything I need. I would just suggest reading a few differant sources and make your own decision. The subject of money can be as complicated or as simple as you want to make it...it's all up to you ??? ;D.

Good luck and fair winds,

Pappy Jack

[newt]

Nick,
My wife and I took sailing courses together-
Instructor and fellow students are very important.  May I suggest a third solution if you really want to make it "her thing" too? Invest and send her to a all female course. My wife was very intimidated by the other "alpha male" type students that were with us on the boat. So much so that I am just now (three years later) getting her back into the learning about sailing mode.
Imagine this:
She correcting you in some sort of cruising protocol, because she learned how to do it at school- she feels pride in her navigation and seamanship, etc.  You kinda say "whatever" but you couldn't be happier that you have a well qualified first mate on board. It sure helps in stressful situations- that is for sure.
My wife is very well qualified, but do to those who over shadowed her out in the ocean, her self-esteem needs a little growth. So above is how I would do it if I had to do it over again.