Mounting & use of Jacklines and tethers and sharks. Oh, my!

[Captain Smollett]

I want to install a couple of heavy duty D-Rings in the cockpit but wanted some input on the best strategy.  At first I was thinking of mounting them on the sole, but then I got to thinking they might be less prone to leaking mounted on the sides.  Also on sides, they might cause fewer stubbed toes or discomfort when stepped upon, etc.

On the sole, the pull is generally going to be tension whereas mounting on the side the pull would be either tension (a fall toward the other side of the boat) or possibly a sheer (a fall toward the same side).

Which would be stronger, assuming both installations utilize backing plates?

These will see regular use since I will use them to tether my children while in the cockpit, but need to be strong enough for more adverse conditions.

Thanks.

[Fortis]

My advice would be well up the bridgedeck wall of the cockpit. Make sure that it is easy to latch on a tether while still well and truly inside the cabin proper...avoids that "moment" in changing watches when you are untethered and likely not fully awake...

The best advice I can offer is to use a nice solid backing plate to the pad-eye. and decent sized bolt with nylon lock nuts on the other side.

Floor mounted pad eyes are a total pain int he butt, you can slip and trip over them, ropes are forever getting tangled in them as you tack, breaking a toe by having it get into the loop as you are midstepis a reall possibility and will not be a revelation to the hundreds that have been there before you. And as I mentioned, you need to get out of the cabin's safety, bend down and hook on. Not optimal.


Alex.

[Lynx]

Use the sanction or mount them next to it. I perfer my harness tether to be tied to the mast with a 50' 1/2 line.

[CharlieJ]

For our tethers I mounted a 1/4 inch stainless bow eye on the wall of the cabin, just outside the companionway. We can clip on before we come out of the companion, we can lie down on the sea berth still clipped on, so no NEED to unclip just to duck below.  We can also get to the mast with tether clipped to the same hard point.

It's mounted close enough to the drop board slides that you don't lean against it when sitting against the cabin.

Tying a tether to the mast isn't a bad idea, but I'm not happy with the 50 foot of line- If you go over, you're are gonna be bait, being trolled. I'd MUCH prefer a short tether that keeps you ON the boat. If you need to move, get a second one and clip on before unclipping the other.

First and foremost rule DON"T FALL OFF THE BOAT. Do whatever it takes, but operate under the assumption that if you fall overboard you're dead. Then take whatever steps needed to stay aboard.

[Fortis]

I always believed that the ultimate bit of yacht safety equipment that NO ONE carries is some sort of gas-charged or otherwise pre-set hoist that will lift you back onto the deck and can be activated by someone clinging to the toerail on the outisde of the boat, being dragged along at 6 knots. So you battle your way up your tether, manage to cling to the boat and hit some activator, and this thing goes kerr-chunk and hoiks you back onto the deck, exhausted but alive and safely in the cockpit.

I have come up with about 4 different mud-maps for such a design...but they are all too heavy, too restrictive or too damned dangerous when left in the "cocked" position for a prolongued period.

I'll get there one day.


Alex.

[Lynx]

Charlie, I had a short tether and as you mentioned, it was hard to stay cliped on the boat close enough not to fall overboard. Not to hyjack this thread or to say what has been said on others, I believe that if you are single handing or with a crew that cannot pull up, when (if) falling overboard you should be able to get back up by yourself. For me, that means getting to the back of the boat and up the stern ladder.  I cannot get up any other place.

Attaching yourself to the mast is an old way of doing it and I may change my mind latter. (to yours?) thanks.

Keeping Kids or pets on board is another issue and quite different.

[AdriftAtSea]

I want to install a couple of heavy duty D-Rings in the cockpit but wanted some input on the best strategy.  At first I was thinking of mounting them on the sole, but then I got to thinking they might be less prone to leaking mounted on the sides.  Also on sides, they might cause fewer stubbed toes or discomfort when stepped upon, etc.

On the sole, the pull is generally going to be tension whereas mounting on the side the pull would be either tension (a fall toward the other side of the boat) or possibly a sheer (a fall toward the same side).

Which would be stronger, assuming both installations utilize backing plates?

These will see regular use since I will use them to tether my children while in the cockpit, but need to be strong enough for more adverse conditions.

Thanks.

I would second mounting the padeyes on the face of the bridgedeck, fairly high up, one to port and one to starboard, and then using a long aluminum backing plate to connect the two inside the actual bridgedeck.  This would give it a lot of strength to resist moving under any load, yet keep them relatively out of the way, but easy to access. 

Also, you could run a short piece of heavy line or webbing between them to use as a handhold. Generally, you want the padeye installation to have a breaking load of somewhere near 6000 lbs, at least according to the specs I've seen.  The shock loading of a 12' fall against a tether hardpoint (assumes a 6' tether, and being on the windward side, falling to leeward), with a 200 lb. man can generate a significant fraction of that as a load...and most tethers are rated to about 6000 lbs for breaking strength. 

I would also recommend not using folding padeyes, which can be much tougher to hook into in bad conditions.

[Cmdr Pete]

I've sometimes wondered what might happen falling overboard and the engine was running. With an outboard motor in the well, the prop sits pretty high.

A tether would have to be very short to prevent my feet from making contact with the prop.

If you're sailing solo, you couldn't get back aboard with the boat moving either. If the tether is too long, you couldn't even keep your head above water.

I guess I could make an extension for the outboard kill-switch lanyard and hook that on too when motoring. But then I couldn't really move about.

If I dont wear a tether, the boat motors away without me. If I do wear a tether, the boat motors along while turning me into hamburger.

Hard to figure where to put an attachment point for a tether that will prevent you from falling completely overboard, on either side, when the boat is only eight feet wide. You would be on a very short leash.

[Captain Smollett]

Hard to figure where to put an attachment point for a tether that will prevent you from falling completely overboard, on either side, when the boat is only eight feet wide. You would be on a very short leash.

How about an adjustable length tether using a rolling hitch?  You could easily double the effective "range" of the tether.  Not perfect either, but an option.

Probably the better option is a short set of tethers with multiple attachment points.  Slows you down moving around, but I'd think this is the "safest."  You are still vulnerable to the situation you describe when attached near the stern, though.

[CharlieJ]

Actually I think the BEST setup is a relatively short tether so you can move around in the cockpit or go below, and a set of jack lines from bow to just forward of the cockpit to clip to when you go  forward. Then you don't have to worry about changing tethers mid trip. A 6 foot tether should do just fine for that.

On the serious offshore boats, jacklines are pretty much a standard thing.

[AdriftAtSea]

I have a jackline running along each side of the center hull on my boat.  Even with a 6' tether, there isn't really any way to fall off the boat, given that the boat is 18' wide.  I think jacklines make more sense than having multiple attachment points to move forward on a boat.  Installing a set of jacklines is both simpler and easier, and the use of jacklines is simpler than multiple padeyes. 

The tether I generally use is double ended.  One end is 3', the other is 6'. 

[s/v Faith]

The tether I generally use is double ended.  One end is 3', the other is 6'.

  I am thinking that they pretty much all are double ended...  :P

;D

I am not sure I understand what you mean by this...  ???

[Captain Smollett]

Though certainly part of the foul weather plan, I did not want to keep jacklines rigged all the time; that's why I was thinking about several hard points for 'general use.'  Though as I think about it, it may not be a bad idea to keep them rigged, since night watches and the like would require movement on deck.

Do ya'll keep your jacklines rigged all the time?

[Fortis]

If it is a 6 HP or so little outboard, I would not go worrying to much. If you wear any kind of footware, the prop will seize upa nd the engine stall out before doing your toes any harm. evena  bare foot into a small outboard prop will stall the motor before doing more then a moderate laceration.

70hp and up is where you get meat mincing.

It you are truly paranoid about it, consider getting one of those thrust vectoring rings for the prop. They now make them as an aftermarket add-on for most outboards and you gain a little bit of efficientcy too (and get rid of 70% of prop-walk).

Alex.

[Fortis]

he means that there is a 6foot tether, that has a third hook set in at the three foot mark. Normall you have both end hooks clipped to your harness and the middle hook attached to the boat. If you find you need more scope, you unclip one of the hooks from the harness and clip it to the boat, then unclip the middle hook. You now have six feet of scope instead of three (And a metal hook that bangs into things, scratches varnish and whacks you on the knuckles swinging around in the breeze).

[Lynx]

Does anybody have personal or first hand experience of falling overboard being tied to a boat?

I have read several stories but not talked to anybody that has. Of course the best thing is not to put yourself into that position where you might fall overboard, although, maybe not possible.

[AdriftAtSea]

Actually, Alex, it is a tether that has a common end point and two legs... one 3' and one 6'—essentially a 9' tether with the attachment point for the harness at the 3' mark, and a clip on either end for the boat—rather than having a second hook in the middle of a 6' leg.  I find this is a lot more versatile than a single tether with two attachment points. 

I do keep the jacklines rigged all the time.  It is simpler to keep them rigged all the time, since I do use them at night, and when single-handing.

While I haven't had the unfortunate experience of being dragged behind a boat via a tether... I have seen it happen on one boat I was on.  Two problems I saw with it... if the boat is making way at all... the wave that builds up in front of you is more of a hazard than anything else.  Dave said it nearly drowned him until we got the boat stopped. Having some way to disengage the autopilot, and having the boat round up would be very important if you're single-handing.  Some boats can't be balanced properly and will not head up into the wind if the tiller is released, running before the wind instead... and that would be a serious problem...

[Captain Smollett]

the best thing is not to put yourself into that position where you might fall overboard, although, maybe not possible.

Umm, how can you "not put yourself into that position"?  You can be knocked or fall overboard pretty much at any time.  Some situations are certainly more risky than others, but about the only way to be COMPLETELY safe from a fall overboard is stay on shore.

And then you can fall in the shower.   ;)

[Lynx]

"Not put yourself in that position."  I would guess that is not really possible when it happens, Like saying "Think BEFORE you fall." This is in a book on Roller Blading.

The better statement would be, not put yourself into a bad situation, like going to the bow or mast. I realize that this is not always possible. On my boat after going to any weather for 6 hrs the bow is really slippery with salt.

Another thing that I have asked but never gotton a response is - Has ahybody tried to get back on board with their tether on?

Just, Anchor, put on the tether, go to the bow, and get in the water SAFELY. Then try to get back on board. Hummmm.
I do not think that I could do that on my Mac 26M and to have a crew menber (if I had one) pull my 6'4" 265 pounds up. Not going to risk my life on that one. So my solution is to go to the stern and climb up the swim ladder, If I am able. If not,   well, fish bait.

[David_Old_Jersey]

The tether I generally use is double ended.  One end is 3', the other is 6'.

  I am thinking that they pretty much all are double ended...  :P

;D

I am not sure I understand what you mean by this...  ???

I think one of these:-




I owuld probably go for an elasticated version if I was ever "upgrading"