Fuels ?!?!

[CharlieJ]

Can't really speak for chemically, as I'm just an old wood butcher. But I grew up using kerosene appliances. When I was a kid we called our lamps "coal oil" 
lamps ;D and used a kerosene cook stove in the house.

The kerosene that was available in the 40s and early 50s was very different from what is around today. Many people used it on a regular basis and it was more highly refined- the stuff we got then was water white and burned cleanly. The kerosene available today is a urine yellow in color and doesn't burn nearly as cleanly. Plus it's gotten much more expensive.

So some 30 years ago now- hmmm- 1973? I began searching for a better fuel. I found 100% Mineral Spirits. At that time, mineral spirits was both cheaper than kerosene and much cleaner burning. I used true kerosene in some heaters back then and the fumes would burn your eyes. As soon as we switched to mineral spirits, the fumes went away. By 1977 or so, I was heating a full time lived in cabin  by the way. Also cooking daily on a 3 burner kero stove.

NOW, the mineral spirits is more expensive, but still usually less than kero. But it's still just as clean burning. Doesn't clog up heater or lamp wicks as much and doesn't clog stove orfices as badly, so I keep using it.

Lamp oil is just plain to durned expensive.  ;D

[maxiSwede]

I see, on my side of the pond I am aware of 2 differernt qualities. 'Light paraffin/kerosene'  and another one called 'paraffin oil' or 'lamp oil'. Lamp oil is usually a bit more expensive, but FAR cheaper than propane/butane.

Neither of these fumes or soots provided you've trimmed your wick. (uhrm, on the lamp that is  ;) )

BTW, both are clear as water, as opposed to diesel nowadays always being mixed with some 5% vegetable oil.

[CharlieJ]

Yabut- over there you still have some sense on things like this. And people who actually USE the stuff, instead of playing with it.

I've long felt that many people on your side of the pond had more boating brains than an awful lot of the folks who own boats over here. Not all mind you , but a good many.

The english for example seem to do quite well cruising on boats that over here wouldn't even get considered as bay sailors.  Small , simple, properly equiped for the task, and USED.

which is one reason the people on THIS forum are here  ;D

[maxiSwede]

Yabut- over there you still have some sense on things like this. And people who actually USE the stuff, instead of playing with it.

I've long felt that many people on your side of the pond had more boating brains than an awful lot of the folks who own boats over here. Not all mind you , but a good many.

The english for example seem to do quite well cruising on boats that over here wouldn't even get considered as bay sailors.  Small , simple, properly equiped for the task, and USED.

which is one reason the people on THIS forum are here  ;D

I've only visited the US once, and that was a one week charter trip to NY City. Nice vacation,  but we didn't get to see much criúising boats... 8)

You're probably right, though, given that the mantra for lots of people in the US is 'biiger is better'
but the trend here is definetely towards 'floating condo's' aswell.

...makes the oldish, smallish but goodish boats cheaper for us, that's ONE advantage anyway.  ;D

[oded kishony]

Hi All,

I'd like to be able to filter the fuel held in the tank from time to time to remove any water or debris. I've heard of Bermuda Fuel filter where you siphon or pump the tank fuel through to clean it up. Is this a product that can be bought somewhere or do I need to construct it?
Is there some other way to accomplish this task?

Thanks for the advice
Oded Kishony

[AdriftAtSea]

Are you talking gasoline or diesel? 

They do make water/fuel separating filters, normally called Baja Filter funnels, which do a pretty good job of separating fuel (gas or diesel) from water and most particulates.  If you created a siphon hose that could feed fuel into Baja type filter, you could effectively "polish" your fuel that way. 

[oded kishony]

Thanks,

I found nothing useful when I searched for 'Bermuda Filter' but 'Baja Filter' resulted in this informative article:

http://www.practical-sailor.com/sample/Fuelfilter.html

Thanks again,
Oded

[AdriftAtSea]

Oded-

Glad to help.  One of my friends has the WM filter mentioned in the article and swears by it.. also has a Baja filter, but says the WM is easier to use and clean.

[oded kishony]

Took the plunge and bought the WM unit. I also purchased a 'siphon pump' from 'Harbor tools' (good place for bargain tools)

Should I empty the tank into a holding tank, then let it sit for a while to allow any water to seperate, then filter it?

Thanks,
Oded

[AdriftAtSea]

I would run it through the filter into  the holding tank.  Then let it sit a while, and then back through the filter in to the main fuel tank.  That way it gets filtered twice. 

One minor problem you'll probably run into is that the new ethanol blends tend to have more problems with water absorbtion, since alcohol acts as an solvent and allows the water to go into suspension in the gasoline.  If the water goes above 1.5% by volume or so, it will cause the alcohol to separate out IIRC, and then you'll lose the primary octane booster, and end up with gasoline at 82 octane or so.

If you're talking about diesel...never mind the above...

[oded kishony]

>If you're talking about diesel...never mind the above...<

Yup, diesel.

~OK

[Fortis]

I went to a truck junkyard and got en electric diesel fuel pump out of a fairly sizeable truck. !2 volt, doesn't weigh much.

A few modifications to return nozzles and such meant I had a really rather remarkably high-volume pump, which could be hooked onto the outflow of the fuel tank with minimal effort (loosening and tightening two hose clamps). The hose then runs form the fuel pump to the 4litre capacity seperation filter with various particle sperating filters and such and then on through to another hose which runs...straight into my fuel intake on deck. This is kind of cool, as the hose that goes into the deck filler is quite stiff and I put a slight bend into it with a heat gun (before it had ever carried diesel!). Once I start the process with a 1/4 - 1/2 full tank or so I can ram the hose that is returning clean fuel to the bottom of the tank and scoot it around to agitate the bottom sediment and gunk....Which gets to get sucked through the filter. So about ten to fifteen minutes of jiggling the hose around in the tank will well and trully "polish" the fuel and clean the tank as well.

If the gap at the bottom of any tank baffles is not large enough for the hose to get under then this may not work very well for you.


I have no idea of the brand of my filter. It looks like a plastic 4litre oil jerry can with extra ins and outs for the hoses and a removable filter panel...it still has the moulded in handle and the screw cap for pouring out water it captures.

It has no markings on it, it came with the boat and its use was explained to me by the previous owner. The truck pump was my addition, I was a bit worried that the pump may set up too high a flow rate and pressure...but it worked fine.


Alex.

[oded kishony]

Hi Alex,

I saw something similar to this offered for rent ($$$) at my marina.

Is there any 'cleaning solvent' that could be added to the tank when it's empty?

Oded

[Fortis]

There are people that swear by some acetone swished through to clean the tank. Other people like a dash of methylated spirits to capture any water and bring it out as an ecapsulated gel.

I figure having an encapsulated gel bubble of water going into your engine is probably worse then just water. And while I have used acetone in petrol tanks, I am not sure of what it would do with diesel, so I have simply used time and the jiggling hose method. Basically, however gunked up your tank is, if you cannot clean it with half an hour of spraying fuel up and around the inside of it, it is time to open the inspection hatch and give it a scrub...or instal an inspection hatch!


Alex.

[Lynx]

Having portable external fuel tanks it is not a problem for me. For those others that have built in tanks. One could remove the fuel guage, heel the boat over and sift weight to the stern or bow, get a small hose and suck the remaining contents out. One should also flush/scrub the bottom of the taks as mich possible as these remains do clogs filters.

[Gus]

6 gallon gas tank with 1:50 mix in the gas locker, and 1 bag of selflit charcoal for the grill :)

I saw @ wallmart a camping stove that works with gasoline for 70 bucks? Is that right? I do have a small alcohol 2 burner stove, but I removed along with the galley (too much weight)

Gus

[Lynx]

Almost all people on boats do not use a gasoline stove. to much danger of the fumes exloding.  I have the 1 burner propane from West Marine. I just do not need a 2 burner.

[AdriftAtSea]

Gus-

If it is a pressurized gasoline stove... it is fairly dangerous for use on a boat.  For ease of use and convenience, I'd go with a propane stove.  For economy, a Diesel or Kerosene stove might be good if you plan to cruise long-term.

[Gus]

Thanks! I wasen't planning in buying it... too big, and I didn't like the idea of using regular gas to cook. My old galley stove that came original with the boat is in good condition, but I couldn't find the marine denaturalized alcohol anywhere.

[Lynx]

West Marine carries it.