The Sailfar.Net Philosophy: Since this is a "Small Boat site"...

[tomwatt]

Looking through the glossy magazines with the 50'+ double-wheel-steered sailing things in them, and the brokerage sites with a huge pile of 40'+ boats for sale, I suspect that the economic downturn has less effect on those that don't "have to ask" the price of their toys. For those of us scrimping and saving, things might be tight, but I'm still not likely to ever genuinely crave something over 35' loa, if for no other reason than the increased costs of ground tackle.
If the dollar plunges more... takes a deeper dive than it already has, all bets may be off.
I had a "bass boat" kind of sailor inquire of me how sails worked, now that the cost of gasoline is beginning to bite into his outings.
:)

[Marc]

Hey Charlie what did you do on the Sara?  I'm a plankowner from the the IKE CVN-69 V-4 grape.  I know what you are talking about, rounding the tip of Africa we were just about walking on the bulkheads mand waves were crashing over our bow.  It was a good time.  Marc

[mrb]

I am not sure how much of it is economics and how much of it is tragedy but I was in Mandeville La. on North Shore of Lake Pontchartrain recently.  The Marina was mostly full of abandoned boats and the marina owners are starting to strip them then crush hulls and send to land fill.  Some sail far boats included.  Real sad to see a permanent end to these boats.

[CharlieJ]

Marc- I was attached to VA-44, which was a replacement air group. We trained new pilots in fleet aircraft, and carrier ops. We'd do 14 day deployments on whichever carrier was in in either Norfolk or Mayport, depending on how the Navy decided. We had been out for close to a week when the strom turned. We offload aircraft, them the ship ducked under (south) of the storm. We never hit the center, but did run into some HUGE storm waves even so.

I was NOT happy about the whole thing- grin

[s/v Faith]

Doesn't Bigger boat = bigger maintenance cost?
                            = more maintenance time?
                            = harder to handle short/single handed?
                            = more expensive to haul overland, if the need arises?
                            = higher slip fees?

It seems 25-30 ft is the sweet spot for a single/couple cruiser. Unless you cruise with sufficient crew aboard that the extra room is really necessary, of course.

Might we add to that list;

= more likely to be forgotten / foreclosed on in the event of economic downturn?

[Captain Smollett]

How much do you feel the current economic reality might be impacting people's view?

I cannot say that I've seen it ... yet.

Still, most power boaters run "no wake" to the sign, then throttles to the stops and full bore from there.  Either no one ever told them, or they simply do not care, that their boat has a 'max efficient cruising speed' and it is NOT full throttle.

Still, I see far more sail boats motoring than sailing...even in EXCELLENT sailing conditions.

I cannot say if there are fewer boats on the water than this time last year...perhaps.  I can better answer that one later in the year.

Sad, though...getting on the water does not HAVE to cost so much.  Sail more, back out of the throttle a bit, etc.  There are ways and it does not have to mean giving up what one loves.

[Jim_ME]

It's been a long afternoon and evening...but a good one...

I posted awhile back about missing the Typhoon 19 that I'd owned and sailed for some 12 years, and had sold. John, I especially appreciated your reply.

I kept the trailer for it an intended to use it with the Hurley 18, but its keel draft at 3'-3" was too deep for the ramps at the large lake where I had been sailing. A few days ago I came upon an opportunity to get a Bristol Corinthian 20 very inexpensively.

It was very satisfying to lower that sailboat into the trailer and tow it home this evening. Glad to be a small traditional boat--an Alberg--again. Looking forward to many hours of fun and daysails. For pure simple enjoyment, the Typhoon has been hard to match. Last season wasn't so good and I found myself regretting having  missed out on a season with my father, who will be 84 in July, even more than expected. As I've deepened my appreciation for how precious time together is, and how there is nothing better than spending it on such a boat.   

It was also interesting to hear the historic news tonight. It has been a memorable day.

[Tim]

Congrats Jim, 
I know for me my Ariel gives me something to work and dream on while my Typhoon gives me something to sail on wherever I want.

More pics would be great!



Tim

[Jim_ME]

Thanks, Tim.

Same here, I have a larger boat for the ocean for the future, but the costs there (with mooring fees, inspections, etc.) are considerably higher, so have been content to sail in the big lake for now.

I enjoyed my Typhoon for 12 years, but have never sailed a Corinthian. It's only a foot longer, but 700 pounds heavier. Also, where the Typhoon design had a slightly shallow cockpit to make the drains work (keep the sole above the waterline), the Corinthian design does not try to do that and is deeper, and with wooden seats, sole, etc. Seems like it may feel a little more secure and comfortable to sit a bit lower in the hull. Guess I'll have to get/make a boom tent/cockpit cover to keep the rainwater out.

The boat did not come with sails, but I think that I have some a jib and Genoa that will work, but will have to find a used mainsail for now. I'm looking forward to putting her in, catching up on my sailing, and seeing how much like the typhoon she sails. Not sure about the ramps on the lake. May not be hard to launch when the water level is high (and pulling up the unloaded trailer), but hauling out in the fall may be an issue. The trailer has a built-in 8-foot extension, and I've made another 10-foot one out of 2x2 structural tube. Should be enough for 2'-9" draft if there is enough water depth...

Here's another photo of my block-and-beam method for suspending a keelboat to load it onto a trailer...

[Tim]

Cool! I looked around for a Corinthian before getting the Ty but they are rare especially on the west coast.

[Jim_ME]

Tim, I would have been happy to find another Typhoon. There were definite advantages to its self-bailing/draining cockpit. The Typhoon's 2" less draft and 700 less displacement made it a bit easier to trailer (and for possible future trailer-sailing). I liked that big bronze bow fitting with the built-in chocks with locking keepers. I did look at one [project Ty] locally that needed much more work than this Corinthian (and, to me, was overpriced at $2000.)

The Corinthian does also have some advantages. The simple two-berth layout and longer cabin trunk may be a bit more comfortable for one or two, whereas the Typhoon has the small quarter berths (for children I assume) and the V-berth is farther forward.

I think that for many the Corinthian is one of those in-between boats, and that may limit their resale value. Too heavy and deep draft to be easily trailered, and too small a cabin to be practical for cruising. Quite heavy for a daysailer/overnighter. Once you are at 2700 pounds range, the Sea Sprite 23 (3300 lb), Alberg 22, or Cape Dory 22 or 25/Greenwich 24 (4000 lb) are also attractive options with more cruising capability.

I already had a suitable trailer and a heavy duty pickup, so these were not disadvantages (requiring new investments) of the Corinthian for me, and I'm happy to have her. Opportunity and affordability certainly came together for me with this particular boat.

I have seen a few of the Alberg Pearson Ensign 22s in your area for reasonable prices. They have a similar cockpit design with the wooden seats and sole--although larger.

Here's one more photo of the boat after lowering onto the trailer.

[Jim_ME]

How much do you feel the current economic reality might be impacting people's view?

Craig, I did hear a story on public radio awhile back about how pleasure power boating was way off at one water-recreation community and that the lack of boating tourists had hurt local businesses that catered to them. I didn't catch all of the story but believe that one aspect of it was the high cost of fuel combined with the ongoing recession.

For me, personally, it is affecting those plans to do some trailer sailing in the foreseeable future, both in my region and also the possibility of heading South (perhaps to Florida) in the winter. I'm shifting focus for now to sailing on the big local lake, where with some schedule flexibility one can get by without a motor at all, and there are no tidal currents to contend with if becalmed...  ;) 

[Captain Smollett]

I have been thinking about this topic a lot lately (5-6 hours per day sanding gives one time to ponder), and wanted to bring it up again.

We, or perhaps just I, talk a lot about boat size and complexity and what that means to getting out on the water.  These ideas resonate with most of the sailfar membership, and many have stated the point(s) better than I.

Still, though, one question has bugged me.  Why do, or should, I care what boat another chooses?  Why give the energy to that is given?  Get my boat set up the way I want and be done with it.

That's a good approach on the whole.  It does, however, have one "flaw," and it reflects back to something I posted earlier.

Seen on a fishing forum (and if I may paraphrase):  "When you are taught something or learn something, that information does not belong to you.  It belongs to the next person that needs it."

This is the point that sticks with me, coupled with a simple observation that in truth has taken me years to figure out how to verbalize.  This observation?

Most people that I encounter fail to realize that boats are very, VERY, specialized to particular uses.

I've noticed too many people that are looking for "a boat," or own "a boat" or have gone sailing on "a boat."   

I find the contrast with how a car purchase is approached to be very interesting.  Cars have specific uses as well: a sedan is not an SUV or a truck.  A sports car fits a different need than a van.  When people buy a car, they seek out something that (a) fits their need and (b) suits their personal style and taste.  (A) usually comes first on the priority list - or so it seems.

Why then, is this same contemplation not applied to boats and boat purchases?  I have seen folks with boats so completely unsuitable for what they said they wanted to do with their boat, like there was absolutely zero thought given to it.  It's just "a boat."

This then gets back to the sailfar/KISS evangelism that I find myself a part.  The notion that "not all boats are equal at all tasks" is information that does not belong to me...it belongs to the next boater I encounter who has not considered this.

One of the most satisfying conversations I have with a boater is to hear that their boat meets their needs. If the boat is different from mine does not offend me; it only defines that their needs are different.  But how often have I had this conversation?

I can easily count the number of times in the last 12 years that I have heard this from the basis of deliberation and experience.  Yet every day, I hear, "we have 'a boat.'"  Usually, in the latter case, the boat is not being used or is on the market, as in

"I have 'A Boat' for sale."

{mindless philosophical rambling mode off}

[rorik]

I liveaboard so I get to see who uses what, at least on my dock. Next to me is a 40' that has a lot of what I consider bells and whistles like refrigeration, central heat, etc.
He's been out no more often than I have and I'm doing a complete refit while living aboard and working full time.
Two boats further down is another 40' with lots of bells and whistles. I think he went out 3 times last year.
Across from me are two Catalina 30's. One went out two or three times last year. The other one, a liveaboard, hasn't moved in a couple of years.
Next to them is a Ranger 33, with no gadgets other than a compass and GPS, and it goes out all the time.
Farther down the dock is a 28' whose owner seems to be very... "organized". But he seems to spend his time making this or that "just so" and I've only seen him out a couple of times last year.
It's an odd mix, but if I had to make any sort of judgment, I'd have to say that owners who own "a boat" to SAIL do use them for that. The rest are, as you implied, just "owners".
As to the sight of sailboats motoring during perfect sailing days, I think that's tied to the fast paced, instant gratification, tight schedule, let's do everything NOW, mindset that's so prevalent.