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Cruisin' Threads => sailFar.net Discussion => Topic started by: Frank on October 24, 2007, 04:31:47 PM

Title: Those who 'stop' cruising
Post by: Frank on October 24, 2007, 04:31:47 PM
In Laura's day 6 post,she wrote.. "I meet one of the liveaboards here at the marina. He confesses that he has been here way too long. What is it that makes cruisers stop moving? Is it fear? Is it comfort? Is it the same thing for all of them or is it different for every person? Do they just get tired?".....It is an odd thing, but very common.While in the Keys a few years back, a liveaboard on a 22fter rowed over in the anchorage to ask for plastic grocery bags.We stuck up a conversation. He was from NY and had sailed down, anchoring here on his way through. How long you been here I asked?...9 years he replied ! It is odd. I think people simply get comfortable,meet people on shore, get to know where to go etc. and seem to 'fit'. Thoughts???
Title: Re: Those who 'stop' cruising
Post by: AdriftAtSea on October 24, 2007, 04:39:57 PM
The nomadic lifestyle of long-term cruising isn't really for all people.  IMHO, a lot of people who go out cruising and then stop and set down roots went cruising to find something, and then found it in a place far from where they started and no longer need to keep going.
Title: Re: Those who 'stop' cruising
Post by: Captain Smollett on October 24, 2007, 04:52:51 PM
Even 'long term' cruisers like the Pardeys and the Martins put down roots for extended stays on shore.  There's no "rule" that says you have to ALWAYS be moving.  I think the essence of the lifestyle is the freedom to make your choice: 'go' when you want, 'stay' when you want.
Title: Re: Those who 'stop' cruising
Post by: Frank on October 24, 2007, 05:35:04 PM
I think you're right. They leave an erea 'searching'...then find an erea with an environment that feels 'right'.Probably slower paced and much 'simpler' than where they come from. Judging from the growth on some of the bottoms I've seen..."putting down roots" is a literal term ;)
Title: Re: Those who 'stop' cruising
Post by: Zen on October 24, 2007, 06:13:00 PM
more likely right, people cruise to find that place where they want to be. For some it is just out there...on the water... on the boat..for others it is away from where they are, that other place....island, cove, country, riverside.
Title: Why is there less people cruising?
Post by: Lynx on December 16, 2007, 06:24:50 PM
I have been in the Bahamas for over 1 month and have been told by the locals that less and less people are cruising every year.

Any thoughts?

Are the sail rags promoting the lifestyle out of existance?

There is also very few boats under 30 feet in Abacos Bahamas.
Title: Re: Why is there less people cruising?
Post by: psyche on December 16, 2007, 09:34:01 PM
Publications in the US push 40 + foot boats as being average and required for cruising. A small boat has creeped up to 36 + feet. When I mention to friends that have refitted and equiped my 8.7 Columbia for offshore cruising and I am planning to go to the Bahamas and beyond they go for their cell phone to schedule an appointment with a psychiatrist. Americans want to have the same luxuries they have on shore. I now read about equiping the boat with a washer and dryer and other "extras" that require more space. The boats have to be larger to carry the electronics and other equipment they have on board. You read about the earlier sailors that we follor like Roth, pardys, Hiscock and others and they sailed by a compass, stars, sun and developed  A keen sense of navigation and boat handling using charts that we would call outdated and suspect. The readers of those publications lose sight that the next port is not the goal but the adventure and the journey are the real destinations. Dan
Title: Re: Why is there less people cruising?
Post by: Pappy Jack on December 17, 2007, 02:03:37 AM
Lynx,

I wouldn't complain too much about this if I were you. It just means that there will be less crowded anchorages ect. , ect.  I would hazard a guess that people are buying bigger boats and therefore are less likely to go sailing. I know, I know, it doesn't make sense but it is more of a hassle to take a big boat out for a day or a week or two than it does a smaller boat...right  ???(IMHO). I would assume that people with big boats also use them for weekend retreats that never leave the dock. What ever the reason it sounds like there will be better cruising out there with fewer boats. Let us know what you find out at the end of your cruise.

Fair winds,
Pappy Jack
Title: Re: Why is there less people cruising?
Post by: Frank on December 17, 2007, 08:10:39 AM
 quote..." I now read about equiping the boat with a washer and dryer and other "extras" that require more space. "   I have that on Jubilee....just put a pic in my gallery under solar panels of laundry day  ;)

(http://sailfar.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10004/normal_cottage_pics-tree_306.jpg)

(Added it for ya, Frank! CapnK :) )
Title: Re: Why is there less people cruising?
Post by: AdriftAtSea on December 17, 2007, 09:41:06 AM
Frank-

A bucket doesn't count as a washing machine... :)

I'd have to agree with Psyche, the modern cruising press seems to say that you can't go cruising unless you have a 40'+ boat.  What they seem to neglect to mention is that until about 10-15 years ago, a boat over 35' was an unusually large cruising boat. 

Unfortunately, too many people who want to go cruising today, want to be able to do so and keep all the luxuries and materialistic trappings of their life ashore.  This means that they need a $750,000 42' sailboat, with a washer, dryer, genset, watermaker, radar, 42' LCD HDTV, satellite TV, satellite phone, etc... This also means that they generally can't afford to leave until they've earned enough money to pay for all of that, which can put off their ability to cruise well into the future.

On one of the other boards I frequent, there's a guy who has a 40' Passport looking to buy a 50-something boat, because the 40' passport is not big enough... I laugh about it... and really hope that he doesn't have any serious equipment failures when he finally goes cruising.  His 100% jib is probably bigger than the mainsail on my boat. 

Another problem with the modern sailing press is that they seem to make it sound like you can't cruise safely on a smaller boat without all the electronics and gadgets that their advertisers sell.  On a 28' boat, do you really need an electronic MOB system?? I don't think so.  Better to rely on harnesses, tethers and jacklines, than to rely on electronics in a marine environment IMHO. 

I think Pappy Jack has an excellent point... the fewer the boats out there, the better it will be for many of us.   Of course, for us small boat sailors, that has always been the case in some ways, since we can often get into anchorages that the 40'+ boats just can't enter safely.  A friend of mine has a 42' boat that draws 10'.  Most of the anchorages I spend time in, he would be aground.
Title: Re: Why is there less people cruising?
Post by: Captain Smollett on December 17, 2007, 11:00:39 AM
There also might be the 'nannyist' philosophy: don't do ANYTHING that might be (cue crescendo of dreadful, ominous orchestral music) --- UNSAFE.

Forget the real statistics that easily show that Lin and Larry sailing a 28 footer across the Atlantic is safer than 1 month worth of driving the highways of a typical American large city.  The psychological perspective that seems to be fostered by the press ("Agah!!!  An-OTHER sailboat crew had to be rescued off the big bad ocean") and in other circles is "Don't YOU try this, or YOU TOO might be a (gasp) VICTIM."

Coupled with this is the resistance of 'being free,' of setting your own course by going off the beaten path.  These two are related, of course, and no political discussion is needed.  We live in a "sport and recreation are ok, lifestyles aren't" type society - if you set your own lifestyle (cruising, backpacking, rock climbing, whatever), you are NOT fitting in.

Finally, we glue it all together with the simple fact that it takes work and experience, to sail the open ocean with something resembling safety.  We all understand this; many folks don't seem to, or don't get it "organically."  Take your average Joe "I wanna try something DIFF'RENT" out there reading and dreaming from SAIL; aside from all the misinformation he gets there, he then goes to the Internet to do a little research.  What does he find?

He might find a forum like TSBB where there is in general a good collection of small boat sailing knowledge, but most of it is geared toward day sailing and protected water cruising.  Many comments point toward the conclusion that even this type of sailing is a lot of work, bigger water is just not worth it.  Plus, it ain't safe.  "Heck, if I can be overpressed in 14.5 kts on a small lake on my Whizbang GeeHaa 20, what would I do on the O-C-E-A-N?"  Some folks will tell him outright "why make it hard on yourself?"

Or, he might find a group like rec.boats.cruising.  Um, need I say more?  Could there BE a faster way to turn off someone's "I want to learn about sailboat cruising" light?

But on there he might see the intrepid tale of a couple - Skip and Lydia - who 'had this dream and began to follow it.'  Then have had MASSIVE problems, or at least have been more candid than most in telling about them, that old average Joe thinks to himself "This IS too much work and it IS too expensive.  Why would I want to do something like THIS?"

Or, he MIGHT find one of any number of other forums or web sites, each with its own flavor.  Most will offer some reasons of why he SHOULD 'follow his dream,' but they will all give THEIR idea of the "must haves."  It will be a perpetual, confusing landscape of unattainability.  "Get a boat that's outfitted, ready to go.  You'll be glad of the money spent."  Or, "Get a project boat and spread your costs out, if you are not afraid of a little work."  The problem is, you cannot OVERESTIMATE the amount of work or money needed!!  How many B.O.A.T. jokes will he find?

So, picture yourself as this average Joe.  You have a little wonderlust and perhaps the desire to see the South Pacific - to have a once-in-a-lifetime adventure.  In the course of a couple of months, you will learn about the THOUSANDS of dollars the preparations will cost, the YEARS of experience you probably should get, the crew and/or boats lost at sea.  Your spouse probably does not share your dream, at least not immediately.

Etc.

Given the inputs, it surprises ME how many cruisers there ARE.   

 
Title: Re: Why is there less people cruising?
Post by: mrbill on December 17, 2007, 12:05:22 PM
In an attempt to (reluctantly) participate more in my sailing adventures, my wife took sailing classes on a local lake. She flunked out but that is another story!

Anyway, the instructor very seriously told them that "sailing on the ocean is way too dangerous".
Title: Re: Why is there less people cruising?
Post by: AdriftAtSea on December 17, 2007, 12:27:10 PM
Of course, it doesn't help to have people like Ken Barnes charging off half-cocked and then having to call for help.. and it seems that the disasters like Barnes's rescue off of Chile get far more press than did Donna Lange's successful circumnavigation in a 28' boat.

Then you have the media seeking idiots, like the Frenchman who was planning to row across the Atlantic earlier this year, and set off not once, but twice, from Massachusetts, and had to be rescued twice... both times less than 150 NM from land IIRC.  The first attempt was canceled since his boat, one he designed himself, was leaking to much to continue...the second was after getting clobbered by the remains of a RTS... ;)

Cruising long distance is a relatively safe thing to do in a properly prepared small boat, with a properly prepared crew.  You're not going to have the luxuries...and that is what they are... of endless running hot and cold water, unlimited electricity, heat and air conditioning, television, etc... and if you expect to have those... you'd best be ready to pony up some serious boat bucks to do it..and it certainly won't be on a Sailfar type boat...

Title: Re: Why is there less people cruising?
Post by: Pappy Jack on December 17, 2007, 05:05:07 PM
Just another little bit of info. Ken Barnes and his BIG boat were just a few hundred miles (or less) away from Donna Lange's LITTLE boat when Ken had to be rescued. In other words, bigger is not always better.

Fair winds,

Pappy Jack
Title: Re: Why is there less people cruising?
Post by: AdriftAtSea on December 17, 2007, 06:17:43 PM
Donna was one of the people who heard Barnes's distress call, and was in contact with Ken IIRC.
Quote from: Pappy Jack on December 17, 2007, 05:05:07 PM
Just another little bit of info. Ken Barnes and his BIG boat were just a few hundred miles (or less) away from Donna Lange's LITTLE boat when Ken had to be rescued. In other words, bigger is not always better.

Fair winds,

Pappy Jack
Title: Re: Why is there less people cruising?
Post by: CapnK on December 17, 2007, 08:30:40 PM
Quote from: mrbill on December 17, 2007, 12:05:22 PMAnyway, the instructor very seriously told them that "sailing on the ocean is way too dangerous".

I'm laughing at that, but it's a painful type of laugh, maybe incredulous laughter... I *learned* in the ocean, on my own, after having read some books.  ;D

Somebody oughta get the spare tiller out and whack some sense into that instructor. Geesh...  ::) ??? ::)

-----------

Glass Half-Empty: Face it - most of our general population is literally almost too fat to sail (or any other type of exercise/strenuous lifestyle). And likely too lazy to want to do more than push a Start button, if what I see on a daily basis is any indication. I could get morbid about it, but there's no point in that...

Glass Half-Full: It means more open, freer anchorages for those of us who *will* take the time and make the effort, so I don't mind all that much. :)

I also wonder if the "less cruisers" is a reflection of our society moving away from sailing overall. I had several brews the other night with an English gent who left on his TransAt today (aboard a Hunter 37 he bought here). Among many other topics, he related to me how prevalent sailing is in France - apparently, it's all over the TV, and it's something that adults and kids do and talk about with enthusiasm. There is a national passion there, and sailors are held in the same regard as the 'sports heroes' are here.

Contrast that with the US where, even in our highly media-ated society, sailing is almost nonexistent. Lots of websites, granted, but very little mass media coverage of it as either a topic or a sport. Skateboarding, foot/basket/baseball, skiing, snowboarding, golf (heh) - but no dinghy racing, or windsurfing, or even much excitement about the big 'un, the (so-called?) America's Cup (which I must admit I have a problem generating excitement over, myself...).

So if in the Bahamas there are less cruisers, I guess I don't find it too surprising, given all the factors. I hope it's making your trip nicer, allowing you to get away from "monoculturism" for a bit of the arguably better "multiculturalism". ;) I'd kind of doubt that the rest of the worlds' cruising destinations feel the same impact, as there are more boats now, and I think maybe more people overall (from more nations) out cruising...

It would be an interesting to see the results of a survey, showing 'then and now' data. :)
Title: Re: Why is there less people cruising?
Post by: CapnK on December 18, 2007, 09:21:07 AM
As an aside -

Hunters aren't generally known as bluewater yachts, and one might think the English gent was a bit loopy to be taking one 'Across The Pond' in mid-winter. That may be so (after all, it's *cold* out there right now!), but from what he was telling me (and if he was a con artist, he's a sailing-knowledgable con artist ;) ) this fellow has been a RYA (http://"http://www.rya.org.uk/) certified sailing instructor as his main source of income for quite a few years, racing his own 10 Tonner in the Fastnet Race 4 different times. Among other things, like certifying Ellen MacArthur, he was also an official handicapper/yacht measurer for the RYA, and holds a Yachtmaster Offshore (& Examiner) certificate.

My only concern for him was that he wasn't able to rebuild/replace the standing rigging, which he stated was approx 20 years old - something I would *certainly* want to do, irregardless of the brand of vessel. However, he has done a TransAt passage 3 or 4 times before, and was making this trip solo, so the risk he's taking is his own. Hats Off to him, I hope he has a wonderful trip! :)
Title: Re: Why is there less people cruising?
Post by: AdriftAtSea on December 18, 2007, 10:07:13 AM
Most Hunters in the <40' range aren't bluewater boats, but the Hunter 37 Cherubini cutter is a very capable boat, and I would guess that the 37' Hunter he is on is a Cherubini design. Still not an ideal time to be heading across the pond, but he seems to have the skills and experience to do so... and there's no risk of running into an RTS at the moment... :) 

For a bit more info on the Cherubini-designed Hunter 37... look HERE (http://www.sailboatowners.com/boats/specs.tpl?fno=0&sku=30179116948437&bts=T).
Title: Re: Why is there less people cruising?
Post by: CapnK on December 18, 2007, 06:32:36 PM
Well, I hope he got a big boost yesterday, because it was a millpond (albeit a very cold millpond) here today! Good water for skiing, Polar Bear Club-style.  ;D
Title: Re: Why is there less people cruising?
Post by: macdiver on December 18, 2007, 09:25:07 PM
I have been looking into getting my first boat.  In particular, I'm considering a small catamaran.  Unfortunately, not many for sell here in the US.  Over the weekend, I was at Barnes and Noble to pick up a christmas gift and I saw a book on multihulls.  The book was written by Gregor Tarjan.  I picked it up and sat down to read.  Throughout the book he keeps comparing 45 foot catamarans to 45 foot monohulls.  In the appendix he reviews several makes of catamarans.  The only one under 40 foot was the Gemini, which he did not give a good opinion of.  I think he said he was including it since it is the all time best sailing cat.  Maybe it is because it is one of the few affordable (relatively) catamarans still produced.  All I could think about while reading the book was who is his audience?  Who are buying all of these 45 foot condomarans? 

The reason no one is cruising is because everyone is working 70 hour weeks to afford their mcmansions and 45 foot boats and associated fees!!!

Title: Re: Why is there less people cruising?
Post by: AdriftAtSea on December 18, 2007, 09:56:13 PM
A couple of good books to read if you're interested in Catamarans are Thomas Firth Jones's Multihull Voyaging, and Chris White's The Cruising Multihull.

Some good small multihulls are:

Heavenly Twins 26
Catalac 8M
Iroquois

While I haven't read Gregor Tarjan's book, I would put the Gemini on the list of pretty good small catamarans. 

The Heavenly Twins, Catalac 8m, Iroquois and Geminis have all made trans-Atlantic passages.  If you have multihull questions, there are several multihull sailors on this site, including myself.

Title: Re: Why is there less people cruising?
Post by: Lynx on December 19, 2007, 06:01:08 PM
I should say that I am just harbor hoping and not crossing oceans. This is really easy. Just move the boat a few miles and stay on the hook for several days, move the boat etc.. Restock when needed. Just do not move the boat in winds over 18 knots.

Did I say "THIS IS EASY!"??  This could be done in a 16 foot
West Wright Potter. Supplies are easy to come by.

The only thing hard about this is when to shower or move the boat and where. Yea the boat moves when you move about and you need to be able to handle that as well as being good at reading the charts. If you can sail in your home waters for 3 weeks, You can cruise the Bahamas. I have seen several 26 footers or less here. My boat buddy crossing the Gulf Stream was in a 12 year old MacGregor 25. A man and his wife in there 30's.

You just need a good boat, some cash reserves and the time and will to do it for 7 months.

I came into Marsh Harbor yesterday, Today I read until noon and then went into town with the dinghy, and did laundry, bought some 1 pound propane cans, bought a Pepsi and a slice of Pinapple upside down cake freshly made, bought some chips, butter and some cheese crackers. checked for mail. Yea, real hard.

Mayby some of the definitions are wrong. Cruising boat should be, the one that you are cruising on.

There is no shortage of lonely places to drop the hook.  Just a shoratage of single females.
Title: Re: Why is there less people cruising?
Post by: AdriftAtSea on December 19, 2007, 10:00:33 PM
Lynx-

You shoulda brought one with you... ;) 

QuoteJust a shoratage of single females.
Title: Re: Why is there less people cruising?
Post by: Auspicious on December 23, 2007, 12:38:08 PM
Quote from: CapnK on December 18, 2007, 09:21:07 AMone might think the English gent was a bit loopy to be taking one 'Across The Pond' in mid-winter.

When I was planning my crossing (albeit somewhat constrained by when the boat was ready) it seemed to me that there are no really good times. There is hurricane season, ice season, and the mid-Atlantic high that migrates around. Most of what is considered "good times" ends up without wind. I came to the conclusion that I'd rather risk a gale than a calm, and shoot for a time and route that had a good chance of fresh breezes.
Title: Re: Why is there less people cruising?
Post by: Lynx on December 23, 2007, 12:45:52 PM
Some of the locals are talking that it is because of the new (now old) fishing regs. These was changed back. This will effect the Big stinkpot/Fishing boats. Not really sure about the cruisers.

Most are expecting a better nest year.
Title: Re: Why is there less people cruising?
Post by: sailorflo on January 12, 2008, 08:59:36 AM
Not to take this in a different direction, but if anyone has been reading Carolina currents or its sister south winds? But after reading the last two issues,Im scared to go south of GA. the water police seem to have nothing better to do than to go from boat to boat and do potty raids. too many other ports to the north,Where the people love to see boats sailing into there cities. And they prove it by offering free d-docks,free bikes, or close to free, They even say hi to you when you see them.                   
   Weather you think you can, Or you think you can't  YOUR RIGHT!!!!!!!
Title: Re: Those who 'stop' cruising
Post by: Captain Smollett on April 04, 2011, 09:54:06 AM
Met an older gent yesterday on a Cal 35; boat has been here for years and I've "Hi"d him on the dock a few times, but never actually chatted.

Found out yesterday that he used to live aboard in Texas.  Well, he said he tried it for 8 months, but it was "not as much fun as I thought it would be." 

That thought got me to thinking about the dream dying..what makes the dream die?  Thought about starting a thread, but found this one...

Reasons I can think of:

** Restoring, refitting or maintaining a boat is more work than anticipated

** Dealing with weather is more, uh, hectic than one thought (we had 30+ knots sustained and 40+ knots gusts two days ago...some folks seemed kinda frazzled).

** It's not all sundowners in crystal blue lagoons like shown in the charter ads in the magazines...
Title: Re: Those who 'stop' cruising
Post by: s/v Faith on April 04, 2011, 10:07:56 AM
Quote from: Captain Smollett on April 04, 2011, 09:54:06 AM
Met an older gent yesterday on a Cal 35; boat has been here for years and I've "Hi"d him on the dock a few times, but never actually chatted.

Found out yesterday that he used to live aboard in Texas.  Well, he said he tried it for 8 months, but it was "not as much fun as I thought it would be." 

That thought got me to thinking about the dream dying..what makes the dream die?  Thought about starting a thread, but found this one...

Reasons I can think of:

** Restoring, refitting or maintaining a boat is more work than anticipated

** Dealing with weather is more, uh, hectic than one thought (we had 30+ knots sustained and 40+ knots gusts two days ago...some folks seemed kinda frazzled).

** It's not all sundowners in crystal blue lagoons like shown in the charter ads in the magazines...

IMHO.

  I think it would be reasonable to add 'attitude' to the list.

  Attitude I speak of is not a commodity that is changeable by the day, but more of a constant in a persons life (like personality).

  If you are a pessimist, negitive person, or generally easily discouraged... you are unlikely to find cruising to be 'for you'....
Title: Re: Those who 'stop' cruising
Post by: CapnK on April 04, 2011, 08:41:14 PM
Quote from: Captain Smollett on April 04, 2011, 09:54:06 AM** It's not all sundowners in crystal blue lagoons like shown in the charter ads in the magazines...

NOOOOOO!!!  :o Say it isn't so... ;)

I would bet that 'attitude', as Craig puts it, determines the *result* of most of the experiences that individuals have. Add to that 'circumstances', like those on John's list, and I think you have the recipe for whether someone has a 'successful' outcome to the dream or not.

Some folks get rolled, dismasted, half-sunk, and then limp into port to spend months to years rebuilding their vessel while subject to the vagaries of importation and other such obstacles that seem common to countries "we aren't from", to eventually sail onward and complete that part of their journeys.

Others spend a couple of years vociferously and publicly promoting their trips, only to turn back within a couple of days, after experiencing their first storm at sea...

I think that 'circumstances' contribute to what the 'attitude' is already deciding about what a situation will be.

Does that make any sense? :)
Title: Re: Those who 'stop' cruising
Post by: CharlieJ on April 04, 2011, 09:19:32 PM
I happen to have saved a copy of something very much on this subject, written by Robert Pirsig, who did "Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance". I think this is probably one of the best takes on the subject I've ever read-  Hope you like it.

Cruising Blues and Their Cure

By Robert Pirsig
(originally published in Esquire, May 1977)


Their case was typical. After four years of hard labor their ocean-size trimaran was launched in Minneapolis at the head of Mississippi navigation. Six and one half months later they had brought it down the river and across the gulf to Florida to finish up final details. Then at last they were off to sail the Bahamas, the Lesser Antilles and South America.

Only it didn't work out that way. Within six weeks they were through. The boat was back in Florida up for sale.

"Our feelings were mixed," they wrote their hometown paper. "Each of us had a favorite dream unfulfilled, a place he or she wanted to visit, a thing to do. And most of us felt sheepish that our 'year's escape' shrunk to eight months. Stated that way, it doesn't sound as if we got our money's worth for our four years' labor."

"But most of us had had just about all the escape we could stand; we're overdosed on vacation. Maybe we aren't quite as free spirits as we believed; each new island to visit had just a bit less than its predecessor."

"And thoughts were turning to home."

Change the point of origin to Sacramento or Cincinnati or any of thousands of places where the hope of sailing the world fills landlocked, job-locked dreamers; add thousands of couples who have saved for years to extend their weekends on the water to a retirement at sea, then sell their boats after six months; change the style and size of the boat, or the ages and backgrounds of the participants, and you have a story that is heard over and over again in cruising areas - romantic dreams of a lifetime destroyed by a psychological affliction that has probably ended the careers of more cruising sailors than all other causes together: cruising depression.

"I don't know what it was we thought we were looking for," one wife said in a St. Thomas, Virgin Islands, harbor after she and her husband had decided to put their boat up for sale and go home. "But whatever it was, we certainly haven't discovered it in sailing. It seemed that it was going to be such a dream life, but now, looking back on it, it just seems . . . oh, there have been beautiful times, of course, but mostly it's just been hard work and misery. More than we would have had if we had stayed home."

A husband said, "We find ourselves getting on each other's nerves, being cooped up like this with each other day after day. We never realized that in order to enjoy being with someone you have to have periods of separation from that person too. We sailed on weekends and short vacations for years. But living aboard isn't the same."

Statements symptomatic of cruising depression vary from person to person, but common to most are long periods of silence in a person who is normally talkative, followed by a feeling of overwhelming sadness that at first seems to have no specific cause, then, on reflection, seems to have many causes, such as:

Everything is breaking down on this boat. Everything is going to heck. Considering the number of things that could break down, the attrition is actually quite normal, but now there isn't the time or tools to make major repairs, and the costs of boatyard labor and overhead are out of sight. So now every part failure - a pump that won't work, a loose propeller shaft, a windlass that sticks - looms up as a catastrophe, and during the long hours at the helm while the problem remains unfixed, it grows larger and larger in the mind.

Money is running short. Most of the big supermarkets are too far from the boat to walk to. Marine stores seem to overcharge on everything. Money is always running short, but now that fact, which was once a challenge, is a source of despair. A serious cruising person always seems to find the money one way or another, usually by taking short-term waterfront jobs, and taking them without much resentment. His boat gives him something to work for. But now the boat itself is resented and there is nothing to work for.

The people are unfriendlier here than back home. Back home people seemed friendlier, but now cruising depression has put a scowl and a worried look on the sailor's face that makes people keep their distance.

All this is just running away from reality. You never realize how good that friendly old nine-to-five office job can be. Just little things - like everyone saying hello each morning or the supervisor stopping by to get your opinion because he really needs it. And seeing old friends and familiar neighbors and streets you've lived near all your life. Who wants to escape all that? Perhaps what cruising teaches more than anything else is an appreciation of the real world you might otherwise think of as oppressive.

This last symptom - the desire to "get back to reality" - is one I've found in almost every case of cruising depression and may be the key to the whole affliction. If one bears down on this point a little it begins to open up and reveal deeper sources of trouble.

One first has to ask where those who are depressed got the idea that cruise sailing was an escape from reality. Who ever taught them that? What exactly do they mean? Scientists and philosophers spend their entire working lives puzzling over the nature of reality, but now the depressed ones use the term freely, as though everyone should know and agree with what they mean by it.

As best I can make out, reality for them is the mode of daily living they followed before taking to the water; unlike cruise sailing, it is the one shared by the majority of the members of our culture. It usually means gainful employment in a stable economic network of some sort without too much variance from what are considered the norms and mores of society. In other words, back to the common herd.

The illogic is not hard to find. The house-car-job complex with its nine-to-five office routine is common only to a very small percentage of the earth's population and has only been common to this percentage for the last hundred years or so. If this is reality, have the millions of years that preceded our current century all been unreal?

An alternative - and better - definition of reality can be found by naming some of its components ...air...sunlight...wind...water...the motion of waves...the patterns of clouds before a coming storm. These elements, unlike twentieth-century office routines, have been here since before life appeared on this planet and they will continue long after office routines are gone. They are understood by everyone, not just a small segment of a highly advanced society. When considered on purely logical grounds, they are more real than the extremely transitory life-styles of the modern civilization the depressed ones want to return to.

If this is so, then it follows that those who see sailing as an escape from reality have got their understanding of both sailing and reality completely backwards. Sailing is not an escape but a return to and a confrontation of a reality from which modern civilization is itself an escape. For centuries, man suffered from the reality of an earth that was too dark or too hot or too cold for his comfort, and to escape this he invented complex systems of lighting, heating and air conditioning. Sailing rejects these and returns to the old realities of dark and heat and cold. Modern civilization has found radio, TV, movies, nightclubs and a huge variety of mechanized entertainment to titillate our senses and help us escape from the apparent boredom of the earth and the sun and wind and stars. Sailing returns to these ancient realities.

For many of the depressed ones, the real underlying source of cruising depression is that they have thought of sailing as one more civilized form of stimulation, just like movies or spectator sports, and somehow felt their boat had an obligation to keep them thrilled and entertained. But no boat can be an endless source of entertainment and should not be expected to be one.

A lot of their expectation may have come from weekend sailing, whose pleasures differ greatly from live-aboard cruising. In weekend sailing, depression seldom shows up, because the sailing is usually a relief from a monotonous workweek. The weekender gets just as depressed as the live-aboard cruiser, but he does it at home or on the job and thinks of these as the cause of the depression. When he retires to the life of cruising, he continues the mistake by thinking, Now life will be just like all those summer weekends strung end to end. And of course he is wrong.

There is no way to escape the mechanism of depression. It results from lack of a pleasant stimulus and is inevitable because the more pleasant stimuli you receive the less effective they become. If, for example, you receive an unexpected gift of money on Monday, you are elated. If the same gift is repeated on Tuesday, you are elated again but a little less so because it is a repetition of Monday's experience. On Wednesday he elation drops a little lower and on Thursday and Friday a little lower still. By Saturday you are rather accustomed to the daily gift and take it for granted. Sunday, if there is no gift, you are suddenly depressed. Your level of expectation has adjusted upward during the week and now must adjust downward.

The same is true of cruising. You can see just so any beautiful sunsets strung end on end, just so any coconut palms waving in the ocean breeze, just so many exotic moonlit tropical nights scented with oleander and frangipani, and you become adjusted. They no longer elate. The pleasant external stimulus has worn out its response and cruising depression takes over. This is the point at which boats get sold and cruising dreams are shattered forever. One can extend the high for a while by searching for new and more exciting pursuits, but sooner or later the depression mechanism must catch up with you and the longer it has been evaded the harder it hits.

It follows that the best way to defeat cruising depression is never to run from it. You must face into it, enter it when it comes, just be gloomy and enjoy the gloominess while it lasts. You can be sure that the same mechanism that makes depression unavoidable also makes future elation unavoidable. Each hour or day you remain depressed you become more and more adjusted to it until in time there is no possible way to avoid an upturn in feelings. The days you put in depressed are like money in the bank. They make the elated days possible by their contrast. You cannot have mountains without valleys and you cannot have elation without depression. Without their combined upswings and downswings, existence would be just one long tedious plateau.

When depression is seen as an unavoidable part of one's life, it becomes possible to study it with less aversion and discover that within it are all sorts of overlooked possibilities.

To begin with, depression makes you far more aware of subtleties of your surroundings. Out on a remote anchorage, the call of a wild duck during an elated period is just the call of a wild duck. But if you are depressed and your mind is empty from the down-scaling of depression, then that strange lonely sound can suddenly bring down a whole wave of awareness of empty spaces and water and sky. It sounds strange, but some of my happiest memories are of days when I was very depressed. Slow monotonous grey days at the helm, beating into a wet freezing wind. Or a three-day dead calm that left me in agonies of heat and boredom and frustration. Days when nothing seemed to go right. Nights when impending disaster was all I could think of. I think of those as "virtuous days," a strange term for them that has a meaning all its own.

Virtue here comes from childhood reading about the old days of sailing ships when young men were sent to sea to learn manliness and virtue. I remember being skeptical about this. "How could a monotonous passage across a pile of water produce virtue?" I wondered. I figured that maybe a few bad storms would scare heck out of the young men and this would make them humble and manly and virtuous and appreciative of life ever afterward, but it seemed like a dubious curriculum. There were cheaper and quicker ways to scare people than that.

Now, however, with a boat of my own and some time at sea, I begin to see the learning of virtue another way. It has something to do with the way the sea and sun and wind and sky go on and on day after day, week after week, and the boat and you have to go on with it. You must take the helm and change the sails and take sights of the stars and work out their reductions and sleep and cook and eat and repair things as they break and do most of these things in stormy weather as well as fair, depressed as well as elated, because there's no choice. You get used to it; it becomes habit-forming and produces a certain change in values. Old gear that has been through a storm or two without failure becomes more precious than it was when you bought it because you know you can trust it. The same becomes true of fellow crewmen and ultimately becomes true of things about yourself. Good first appearances count for less than they ever did, and real virtue - which comes from an ability to separate what merely looks good from what lasts and the acquisition of those characteristics in one's self - is strengthened.

But beyond this there seems to be an even deeper teaching of virtue that rises out of a slow process of self-discovery after one has gone through a number of waves of danger and depression and is no longer overwhelmingly concerned about them.

Self-discovery is as much a philosopher's imponderable as reality, but when one takes away the external stimuli of civilization during long ocean hours at the helm far from any land, and particularly on overcast nights, every cruising sailor knows that what occurs is not an evening of complete blankness. Instead comes a flow of thought drawn forth by the emptiness of the night. Occurrences of the previous day, meager as they may have been, rise and are thought about for a while, and then die away to return again later, a little less compelling, and perhaps another time even weaker, until they die away completely and are not thought of again. Then older memories appear, of a week past, a month past, of years past, and these are thought about and sometimes interrelated with new insights. A problem that has been baffling in the past is now understood quickly. New ideas for things seem to pop up from nowhere because the rigid patterns of thought that inhibited them are now weakened by emptiness and depression. Then in time these new thoughts wear town too, and the empty night dredges deeper into the subconscious to tug at, loosen and dislodge old forgotten thoughts that were repressed years ago. Old injustices that one has had to absorb, old faces now gone, ancient feelings of personal doubt, remorse, hatred and fear, are suddenly loose and at you. You must face them again and again until they die away like the thoughts preceding them. This self that one discovers is in many ways a person one would not like one's friends to know about; a person one may have been avoiding for years, full of vanity, cowardice, boredom, self-pity, laziness, blamingness, weak when he should be strong, aggressive when he should be gentle, a person who will do anything not to know thesethings about himself - the very same fellow who has been having problems with cruising depression all this time. I think it's in the day-after-day, week-after-week confrontation of this person that the most valuable learning of virtue takes place.

But if one will allow it time enough, the ocean itself can be one's greatest ally in dealing with this person. As one lives on the surface of the empty ocean day after day after day after day and sees it sometimes huge and dangerous, sometimes relaxed and dull, but always, in each day and week, endless in every direction, a certain understanding of one's self begins slowly to break through, reflected from the sea, or perhaps derived from it.

This is the understanding that whether you are bored or excited, depressed or elated, successful or unsuccessful, even whether you are alive or dead, all this is of absolutely no consequence whatsoever. The sea keeps telling you this with every sweep of every wave. And when you accept this understanding of yourself and agree with it and continue on anyway, then a real fullness of virtue and self-understanding arrives. And sometimes the moment of arrival is accompanied by hilarious laughter. The old reality of the sea has put cruising depression in its proper perspective at last.






Title: Re: Those who 'stop' cruising
Post by: Oldrig on April 04, 2011, 09:39:49 PM
Charlie,

Thanks for posting that.
It's one of the most profound things I've read in a long time!

I've never read Pirsig's famous book, but I'll have to get it.

Sail on!

--Joe
Title: Re: Those who 'stop' cruising
Post by: CapnK on April 04, 2011, 10:39:33 PM
Joe said it all.

Grog!
Title: Re: Those who 'stop' cruising
Post by: Tim on April 05, 2011, 12:06:51 AM
I'll say! In fact a round of grogs
Title: Re: Those who 'stop' cruising
Post by: Captain Smollett on April 05, 2011, 05:10:04 PM
Indeed. Wow. Grog.
Title: Re: Those who 'stop' cruising
Post by: Captain Smollett on April 05, 2011, 07:47:20 PM
Upon further reflection of this excellent piece, I was reminded of something.  From an earlier post (http://sailfar.net/forum/index.php/topic,1192.msg28250.html#msg28250):

Quote

Living aboard is not much different from living anywhere else.  The local environment is different, perhaps, but the issues are not.  The attitude wins the day.


I think, as Pirsig points out, the "problem" lies in the expectation that cruising will somehow be different from day-to-day existence.
Title: Re: Those who 'stop' cruising
Post by: marujo_sortudo on April 05, 2011, 08:52:06 PM
Amen.  A big grog for introducing me to this bit of Pirsig I hadn't come across.  ZAMM influenced me a lot in my high school days.

Reminds of the day I'd decided to reorient my life towards this cruising dream which I'm still moving towards.  It was one of the worst days sailing I've ever had; though, I doubt it'll register as that bad of a day should I keep with this lifestyle for a long time.  A friend of mine and I had gone out for a short daysail on another friend's boat.  The two of us had been caught in a surprising amount of wind after clearing an island and heeled over substantially.  Several unsecured pieces of boat gear forever joined the sea and my crewmate's cell phone (our only communications device aboard) landed in the wet bilge (a fall from which it never recovered.)  There were a number of other minor gear failures and then we were becalmed for hours.  After giving up on the wind helping us reach harbor before nightfall, we started the engine.  The engine was throttling strangely, but, as neither of us were particularly engine-savvy, and light was receding, we continued to run it.  As we neared our mooring field, we put away the sails, only to have the engine subsequently seize.  Neither the wind or tide was great, but both were foul, and we quickly fell away from the harbor as the sun finished setting.  It was at this point that we realized there was no source of light aboard, unless you were to count the dim glow from my hand-held GPS which wouldn't cast light for more than a foot.  As this was in Maine, there were also few lights ashore and their positioning was confusing as neither of us had been to this harbor at night, and had in fact only been here a half a dozen times in the day.  So, we took the sails back out of the bags, raised them in the thin light (there may have been the sliver of a moon and, of course, the stars,) and slowly in the light puffs climbed back towards the mooring field in the diminishing foul tide.  Eventually, we gained it, thanks more to the aid of the GPS than any ability to read the shore lights.  However, our mooring was almost invisible as we slowly tacked through the field only able to make out other boats perhaps 30 yards ahead, and searching for our free mooring which we only recognized perhaps 5 yards away.  Still, we were lucky enough to find it on the first try, and after tiding up the boat, we had only to row to the dock in my friend's dinghy (which is easily the worst rowing dinghy I've ever used, but that's another story.)  We found the dock, but not on the first try and ended up pulling ourselves under the upper portion of it, limbo-style, to get to the dinghy dock.

None of this is particularly remarkable, nor really that 'bad' of a day of sailing, in my opinion.  The thing that struck me that day was that with each misfortune or delay, my crewmate proceeded to curse and swear, often at length, and was clearly far from having a good time.  My attitude was simply, "ok, but what can we do now," and I even enjoyed myself a bit, though I was out of my depth and skill as a sailor at the time.  Still, by the time we had reached the dock, I had decided that I would chase my childhood dream of living on a sailboat.  Why?  Simply because this kind of stress made me feel alive, useful and it seemed to bring out my better qualities.  I thought that a life that would have this effect on me might be worth pursuing.  Still, I won't claim that know how the experiment will hold up.  When I try and make the move to cruising full-time, will it become a lifestyle, or shall I quit it shortly thereafter?  I don't know, but I look forward to finding out, and finding out more about myself in the process....
Title: Re: Those who 'stop' cruising
Post by: CharlieJ on April 05, 2011, 09:14:00 PM
ROFL-

This goes only to prove what I tell folks (taken from Lats and Atts by the way)

The difference between an ordeal and an adventure is

ATTITUDE!!!
Title: Re: Those who 'stop' cruising
Post by: Chattcatdaddy on April 06, 2011, 04:37:14 AM
Grog! Great article!

In my opinion sailing/cruising and depression doesn`t build virtue/character, it Reveals character. Cruising will not cure you day to day problems but will only bring them to the fore front of your life once the daily grind cannot hide them anymore.
Title: Re: Those who 'stop' cruising
Post by: Bubba the Pirate on April 06, 2011, 05:54:44 PM
Grog

Good stuff. 
Title: Re: Those who 'stop' cruising
Post by: maxiSwede on April 07, 2011, 10:57:33 AM
Good reading!  Thanks for sharing it.

I did not know that R. Pirsig was/is(?) a cruising sailor too...  :o

His observations are so true - we see them and meet them everywhere, and we find it sad with all those broken dreams and abandoned projects...

Cruising is not something that fits each and everyone, that's for sure.

Maybe one has to feel a bit of a 'misfit' on shore, in the 'normal life' to enjoy it?  ;)
Title: Re: Those who 'stop' cruising
Post by: Jim_ME on April 07, 2011, 05:52:07 PM
I read Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance in my high school days, too, and it is interesting to experience his unique writing voice again.

I have picked up Lila his 1991 book about cruising down the Hudson River by sailboat. I stumbled upon it awhile back, and having briefly day sailed on the Hudson River a few years back, visited the Peekskill area of the Hudson since, and was impressed with the beauty of the hills rising dramatically from the river. The book has sat on the shelf unread, as I read lighter authors and stories.

The front flap says that ZAMM was initially rejected by over 120 publishers, so that says something about perseverance itself--a virtue for writers as well as sailors.