Here is a site about a guy that is planing to sail nonstop around the world on a Triton 28.
He plans on doing it in 10 months and hopes to raise $1,000,000 for the fight against breast
cancer. http://www.thepinkboat.org/
Fair winds and full sails,
Pappy Jack
P.S. Oh ya,he's going to paint his boat PINK ::)
I wish him the world of luck, in a worthwhile venture.
But-
Where on earth does he figure to stow 10 months worth of food on a Triton? Not to mention water.
Great sail boat but I seriously feel he is under boated for the job. The displacement is simply not there for a non stop sail.
Quote from: CharlieJ on August 03, 2011, 07:21:40 PM
Where on earth does he figure to stow 10 months worth of food on a Triton? Not to mention water.
Rain. Or R/O Watermaker.
Storing the food should be less of an issue. A V-berth could hold a WHOLE HEAP of rice, for example.
I have to admit my first reaction was cynical also, just couldn't point to why. I am unable to get the site to load so I had better not say anything more.
Wonder how he manages to cook/eat? Short of burning anything that floats by, I'd guess that if he managed to stock enough food and water aboard, he'd start running into fuel storage issues next. Unless he's stocking pre-packaged ready-to-eat meals that need no water or cooking. But even a 6 month's supply of MREs is going to overflow the vee-berth and beyond.
Remember that Yves Gelinas planned nonstop RTW when he embarked in his A-30. Admittedly, the A-30 is a bit bigger, but not THAT much.
Food and fuel is not that big of an issue; Yves cooked with kerosene. Water is.
Gelinas planned to resupply underway with captured rain. He had a rig to get rain from his mainsail, collected at a point along the boom and piped to his water tanks.
This was the reason he had to stop in South Africa. His passage from northern France was longer than he anticipated and actually was relatively rain-free. He had only a few liters of water left when he arrived.
As I think about it this morning, I try to imagine fitting 10 months of food in this boat...for one person. I don't think it would be a problem at all. The v-berth is huge, the area under the cockpit is huge (take the engine out, as Gelinas did and as has been done on my boat), and the areas under the settees are huge. The hanging locker is quite large as well.
For a voyage like this, you don't need a lot of clothes are other "amenities" that we usually want to bring along 'cruising' or even 'voyaging."
With the right mindset, I just don't see this as that big of a deal. That's the key, though. How many us really think in terms that practical?
Since he's circled on a Triton, I'd LOVE to hear James' thoughts on this if he'd care to offer them.
My final thought - whether he ends up doing it nonstop or not (as Gelinas did not) is immaterial to me. That part of it is to a degree a publicity stunt. Sailing around the world on a Triton will be a HUGE accomplishment whether he stops along the way or not. Either route to success can make publicity for his cause, and indeed, it could be argued that having some "issue" that requires a landing may help in his fund raising goal....drama sells.
From the site:
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A lot of people ask about where I will stop: I am not going to stop. Once I leave San Francisco, I will not stop until I return some 25,000 miles and approximately 10 months later. Once people grasp this, the next question is usually, "How in the heck are you going to carry enough food and water for a year?!" I plan to utilize watermakers, and catch rainwater when I can. For food, I will bring a year's worth of dehydrated meals aboard which can be prepared with only boiling water.
Admittedly, I don't like the 'speed record' rhetoric, but hey. I can also see some bravado pushing for the raising of funds for the cause. I'm also a bit curious about the "About Me" page which outlines "Why Breast Cancer" but does not say anything about sailing experience.
This could be another case of unrealistic expectations that ends almost before it really gets underway. I think there's more to sailing a trip like this than publishing a Google Map with some cool RTW waypoints on it.
And the big problem *I* see with non-stop RTW stuff is that there is no way to really plan to be in certain places "in season" due to the way the seasons overlap. At least that's what I've seen in my armchair planning. The stops are as much about wx as rest or whatever. It seems to me that planning non-stop pretty much guarantees some atrocious weather in at least one of the oceans.
Maybe I'm overthinking it.
Judging by the months of taking food off of Faith after we got back, I would say we had 6 months of provisions when we left... :)
Now, of course we would have SURVIVED on what we had, but probably had to re-provision because we would long since have run out of Oreos. ;D
Why am I not being able to get on the site?, keep getting a
QuoteServer Error in '/' Application.
Object reference not set to an instance of an object.
Huh, don't know.. I have the same problem here.
Thank Microsoft for their overly complicated approach to solving computer problems. And, the site host using way outdated server software.
That site is being hosting on a Microsoft IIS 6.0 (released in 2003 on 2003 Server and XP Pro versions of Windows and essentially obsolete in 2008 with the release of IIS 7.0) server with ASP.NET development (and serving) framework. That means simple things are handled in a complicated way (typically), and whatever software object the server needs (to serve for YOUR browser) is not defined properly.
Since some of us have no problems and some do, troubleshooting requires we find the difference between our requests to that server. The first question, is, what browser are you guys using?
I'm using Firefox 3.6.18 and have no problems viewing the site.
When I use the text based 'browser' lynx to dump the http headers, I get an "Internal Server Error," but still get the header dump. Like I said, ain't MS wonderful?
When I simply view the site with lynx (as a text based browser, not to examine headers), it loads fine.
No one in their right mind should develop a site on ASP.NET, but what do I know?
But hey, I'm not getting paid enough to troubleshoot THEIR web site, so why am I bothering? Forward your questions to them, and please include in your request that they test their web site for W3C compliance in a variety of browsers BEFORE publishing on the Web.
That said, here is the error I see...
QuoteServer Error in '/' Application.
Object reference not set to an instance of an object.
Description: An unhandled exception occurred during the execution of the current web request. Please review the stack trace for more information about the error and where it originated in the code.
Exception Details: System.NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object.
Source Error:
An unhandled exception was generated during the execution of the current web request. Information regarding the origin and location of the exception can be identified using the exception stack trace below.
Stack Trace:
[NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object.]
EightFootScrews2008.common.helpers.Utility.GZIPCurrentRequest() +71
EightFootScrews2008.common.masterpages.Main.Page_Load(Object sender, EventArgs e) +5
System.Web.Util.CalliHelper.EventArgFunctionCaller(IntPtr fp, Object o, Object t, EventArgs e) +14
System.Web.Util.CalliEventHandlerDelegateProxy.Callback(Object sender, EventArgs e) +35
System.Web.UI.Control.OnLoad(EventArgs e) +91
System.Web.UI.Control.LoadRecursive() +74
System.Web.UI.Control.LoadRecursive() +146
System.Web.UI.Page.ProcessRequestMain(Boolean includeStagesBeforeAsyncPoint, Boolean includeStagesAfterAsyncPoint) +2207
Version Information: Microsoft .NET Framework Version:4.0.30319; ASP.NET Version:4.0.30319.1
Probably easier to fit a RTW worth of provisions on a Triton then figure out what is up with that site. ;)
This is the key bit:
Quote
Object reference not set to an instance of an object.
Some coder wrote a line of code referencing something that, so far as the server can tell, does not exist. That's a rather common error in code of this type, and SHOULD be pretty easy to find and fix. Someone didn't REALLY test the web app on that server is my guess.
What's totally interesting is that you guys get the error and some of us don't.
It's pretty much got to be browser specific. That line of code is NOT being executed for MY requests, but is for yours.
It's all rather silly, on several levels.
And...how much confidence will "not bug checking his web page" inspire in folks wishing to invest in his cause to raise $$ for Breast Cancer Research?
And more to the point for THIS SITE....what does THIS kind of error on a web page say about how his boat preps for a nonstop RTW are going to be done?
True, he may be an astonishingly fantastic sailor with more offshore fortitude than I will EVER have...no way to know at this point. But the question is a fair one, I think. Maybe that's too harsh...maybe.
Even assuming he hired out his web site production, going "live" before it's ready and publicizing the attempt at a WORLD RECORD is a bit of responsibility...I'm just wondering if I am the only one drawing some parallel between the "attempt" at publicity and the "attempt" at a world record solo nonstop RTW sail.
Sorry...just musing.
I am using Firefox 5.0 with "Noscript"
But since I don't plan on sending any money (more cynical by the second) I am not going to pursue it any more.
Quote
Probably easier to fit a RTW worth of provisions on a Triton then figure out what is up with that site. Wink
;D
I don't think I'd draw too many conclusions on his planned voyage based on his website. A great many very skilled people out there really have no clue how the world wide web works. This page was likely built using a template, or quite possibly, by a friend or relative who was taught ASP in college and hasn't yet gotten out of the MS mindset (I have friends who have gone this exact route early in their web development careers).
A quick browse of his site (works fine for me) doesn't really give much background on the skipper or his boat preparations. He's not planning on leaving for a couple of years, so quite possibly he hasn't done much in the way of preparations, yet. While it is quite easy to dismiss him as so many others have bragged about grandiose plans only to sheepishly slink away when they fall apart, I'm perfectly willing to give him the benefit of the doubt.
I have no doubt that the voyage he proposes is possible. Certainly, far less likely voyages have been completed (I mean, who in their right mind would cross the Atlantic in a six foot boat?). Only time will tell if it is successful or not. I'll be interested to see what happens over the next year, or so.
My skepticism is not from the ill-working site or whether the RTW can be done. Rather I always get skeptical when somebody is asking for donations no matter how important the cause is when there is a feat that this person is going to perform that is 2 years away.
Quote from: Godot on August 04, 2011, 12:59:06 PM
While it is quite easy to dismiss him as so many others have bragged about grandiose plans only to sheepishly slink away when they fall apart, I'm perfectly willing to give him the benefit of the doubt.
This is my thought, too.
On the one hand, I bristle about these folks starting adventures like this and seeking publicity BEFORE the fact...and they often end in some kind of well noticed failure.
But, on the other hand, his seeking publicity COULD well be simply because he's trying to raise a large chunk of money for a worthy cause. That takes time.
What gives me pause: he wanted to do the trip THEN thought of a way to do it fund-raising wise. It could be argued that he has no real personal motivation regarding breast cancer research.
Here's the text of his "About Me" page:
Quote
The most common question I receive is why breast cancer?
Breast cancer affects not only the women who are diagnosed and bravely fight this disease, but all of the people- the friends and family in their lives who love them. When I sat and thought about my reasons for wanting to sail around the world, they seemed a bit selfish and without purpose.
There is so much each of us can do to positively affect and beat this disease. I wanted my sail to have a mission that would serve not only this sailor's wanderlust, but to raise research funding for a greater good. I am risking my life for this voyage, while millions of women have their lives risked everyday from cancer. I am inspired by their courage and devote this sail to them.
"I wanted my sail to have a mission" makes me wonder. Interpretation of that can go either way. Maybe I'm reading more into this than needs to be there, but (a) it's clear he wanted to sail RTW and try for a speed record (mentioned on another page) and thought of the mission after the fact, (b) does not mention any personal connection to breast cancer, (c) no mention of background on the About *ME* page and (d) it's just an odd way, to me, to word this.
On the issue of the speed record:
Quote
The Record
The International Sailing Federation/ World Speed Sailing Council maintains the records for the world. This journey falls under the following: Round The World Non-Stop(26.1.a), Under 40ft (20.c), Single Handed (21.f), Unassisted (21.e). The ISAF/WSSC will place a "black box" aboard and ratify the attempt.
Darwind will be the smallest length overall traditionally ballasted yacht to complete this course. Currently this honor is held by Alain Maignan from France aboard Schouten a 10.6m (34.78ft) monohull. His trip took place from October 7 2006 - April 11 2007 for an elapsed time of 185 days 22 hours and 2 minutes.
A smaller yacht has completed this record but it was a "sport boat" with a canting keel. Alessandro di Benedetto from Italy aboard "Findomestic Banca? a 6.5m (21.33ft) Mini recently completed the record. He started the October 28 2009 and went until the July 22 2010 lasting a total of 268 days 19 hours 36 minutes and 12 seconds. Naturally, I would like to outright beat this time record. Look out Alessandro!
What does it say to even be talking about speed records with a TRITON for crying out loud. No doubt, the Triton is among my Top 5 favorite boats, but it's more of the slow, steady "get you there" tortoise than the "might stop halfway around" hare.
But again, I am willing to give him the benefit of the doubt. There's enough about this 'story' that could very well be perfectly honest, innocent and cool. That my cynicism flags are flapping says probably more about me than him.
Sailing Solo around the world is a feat worthy of relatively few of us...why the theatrics? Would just doing it, nonstop or not, smallest or speed records or not, be a worthwhile means to raise awareness and money for cancer research? Why does there have to be all the superlative (smallest, fastest, etc) to accomplish something that very few humans have done?
The Pink Boat should be publicity enough...but that's been done, too. ;D
I've seen how modest and humble approaches on the Internet can raise relatively large sums of money in a short period of time for worthy causes. I just don't think the theatrics are necessary for that part of it. That's my opinion.
If it were me? I'd stop talking about speed records (that are perhaps unrealistic given his boat choice) and simply get the word out...I'm doing this to raise money for research. People will likely not pay more just because it's a record attempt.
(You can tell it's too hot outside for me to be doing any real work today...heat index around 108 again...)
I sure hear what you are saying. Personally, I wouldn't donate any money until I am reasonably certain he is honestly serious. I mean, I could very easily donate money directly to the Breast Cancer Research Foundation and know that none was being diverted to fund his sail. Which brings up the question, how is the donated money being used?
My guess is you are quite right. He wants to go around the world non-stop. He probably started feeling guilty about how selfish a trip like this was, so went hunting for a reason. Or perhaps he felt that non-stop circumnavigations are becoming common enough to not warrant some publicity that he craves (and may also feel guilty about). That's probably also why the world record attempt is important. It has to be newsworthy (at least in his eyes). That doesn't really change anything, though. Sailing IS a selfish activity. If it makes him feel better by supporting a worthy cause, no matter what his motivation, I don't have any real problem with it. I would like to understand where any donations go, though.
For what it's worth, I sent a few dollars to Nick Jaffe during his trip. Clearly, that trip was quite selfishly a personal voyage (my favorite kind). But I enjoyed his story and rewarded him for it. I've also sent a few bucks Teresa for her iceberg movie (even though I don't understand the point of it), because I like the thought of an adventure (vicariously living until I can do the same myself).
Quote from: Godot on August 04, 2011, 03:19:44 PM
Sailing IS a selfish activity.
With you except for this line. It surely CAN be...no doubt. But it *IS* selfish in a transcendental way? I don't follow that.
Sailing is a means to get from one place to another. WHY I want to make that trip may be selfish, or it may not.
We sail for our own benefit and enjoyment. Who could really dispute that? I find nothing st all wrong with it.
Quote from: Godot on August 04, 2011, 04:21:56 PM
We sail for our own benefit and enjoyment. Who could really dispute that? I find nothing st all wrong with it.
I think there well can be more to it than that?
What of the man who sails for his livelihood? What of sailing for education of others? What if someone sails to get from one place to another, and has simply chosen that means to do so (perhaps they cannot afford fuel, or inherited a sailboat or some such) and their need to make that trip is not just for enjoyment.
"For our own benefit" is a loaded phrase, though. We have jobs for our own benefit, we eat for our benefit, we marry for our own benefit, but these are not typically seen as selfish acts. They are merely the acts of living beings. Technically selfish, I suppose, but only if you view life itself to be selfish in the same fashion.
By that definition, EVERYTHING we do is selfish, and since in this philosophy there is no non-selfish, the mention is superfluous. I happen to think 'selfishness' is a balance - did I serve other's needs today, or ONLY my own. Did I perhaps do without so another could have? That is the distinguishing line (in my mind), and within that frame, I don't think sailing, or any other activity, HAS to be considered selfish by definition at all.
Consider: what if I am an angry person who takes out my work stress on my family - my wife and children - in a very destructive way. Serendipity leads me to learn that a few hours of sailing per week, alone on the water with my thoughts and fears, vents a sufficient amount of that stress that I no longer allow it to bleed onto my loved innocents. Is sailing in this context selfish?
Sorry...I've just been elbow deep in philosophical analysis of the Bill of Rights, the concept of Rational Anarchy and fundamental definitions of "the human condition" as it relates to freedom, personal responsibility and governance. Thus, I am in a very contemplative and philosophical frame of mind.
Quote from: Captain Smollett on August 04, 2011, 04:49:43 PM
Quote from: Godot on August 04, 2011, 04:21:56 PM
We sail for our own benefit and enjoyment. Who could really dispute that? I find nothing st all wrong with it.
I think there well can be more to it than that?
What of the man who sails for his livelihood? What of sailing for education of others? What if someone sails to get from one place to another, and has simply chosen that means to do so (perhaps they cannot afford fuel, or inherited a sailboat or some such) and their need to make that trip is not just for enjoyment.
Perhaps a person COULD sail for his livelihood, or education. I'm not sure anyone here does, though, and if so they are the exception to the rule. As well, sailing as a mode of transportation does not make much sense outside of a recreation standpoint in this day and age, although I have a deep seated fear in the pit of my belly that that may change in the future (not because transportation by sail in a bad thing; but because the economy and society would have to have degraded significantly to make it practical again). I think for nearly everyone (your angry person example not withstanding), we sail because it brings us joy, not for the benefit of anyone else; although we may try to justify it otherwise. There are exceptions to every rule in life; but that doesn't disprove the point.
Now, is doing something selfishly for ones own benefit wrong, evil, or otherwise undesirable? In my humble opinion, provided you aren't unreasonably damaging someone else (sailboats "ruining" a sea side cottage's ocean view does not count as reasonable in my book), increasing personal joy is a very moral thing to do. I, personally, look at it as a responsibility to enjoy as much as possible the short span of time we have on this planet.
Quote from: Godot on August 04, 2011, 05:09:06 PM
Perhaps a person COULD sail for his livelihood,
A person COULD? Might that be taken as a bit insulting? I know of 1000's of sailing coaches, harbor tour guides, tall ship cruise ship crews and small crewed charter captains that make their living on the water. There are also still sailing fishermen in other parts of the world.
Some of the above I know personally. I knew one officer of a sailing cruise ship that died at sea.
There are also folks who make their living writing or via photography, or perhaps even via repairs to other boats. I know one very gifted woodworker/carpenter who has sailed around the world, and drops his anchor where he thinks he can find work. When work in that area dries up, he picks up anchor and heads to another - even if it means crossing an ocean. He has the strongest work ethic of any human being I have ever met, working in all weather sometimes 14 hours a day, and he travels out of town to an inland city where he continues to work weekends. When he does take time off to sail just for fun (which I've never seen him do in the nearly three years I've known him), he's earned it. But he DOES sail across oceans to find work in different areas.
I'm struggling how to call a man's chosen livelihood and means to execute it 'selfish.' Sorry...I just don't agree at all.
Quote
or education.
How-to and racing coaches, national military training programs that use sailing to instill camaraderie, teamwork and seamanship (the US and Brazil come to immediate mind) are not exceptions...there's bunches of them out there.
Also, we can consider historians and adventure sailors that do historical re-enactments. These programs test theories about what was possible with a given technology and help historians properly analyze the clues they have about specific events.
Quote
I'm not sure anyone here does, though,
I know several people on this web site alone that make livings via sailing. We might call them exceptions if we want, but the statement was that SAILING was selfish, not just the subset of sailfar sailors.
Quote
and if so they are the exception to the rule.
I'm not sure what ratio of a subset to the whole defines an exception. I maintain that there are many thousands of people worldwide that sail not JUST because of pure selfish recreation and fun as you assert.
Further, recreation, as my 'angry man' example was meant to show, is not necessarily selfish. Man needs recreation. Sailing is no more selfish than watching a football game, playing golf or simply sitting on the front porch watching the grass grow. No man "works" 24 hours per day, or even the 16 or so waking hours.
Without some form of recreation, and ALL human societies have it, a man becomes unhealthy pretty quickly. As I said, staying healthy in this fashion may well serve the others around him.
Quote
As well, sailing as a mode of transportation does not make much sense outside of a recreation standpoint in this day and age
Only within a very narrow minded definition of what "makes sense." I happen to think sailing makes a TON of sense: it's environmentally clean, quiet and the transportation cost itself is zero. Many times, I've used a sailboat to get from point a to point b, and while the sailing itself was enjoyable, it was a mode of transportation.
If *YOU* don't think it makes sense for *YOU*, that's fine. But please don't paint it with such a broad brush - a very ethnocentric brush it seems, as I assume you are saying it does not make sense due to one parameter - time.
Quote
I think for nearly everyone (your angry person example not withstanding), we sail because it brings us joy,
That would only be selfish if that is the ONLY reason a person sails. That which brings us joy is not, prima facie, selfish. For example, I get tremendous joy witnessing my children accomplish something on their own, independent of any input from me. I think that's the antithesis of selfishness as I have neither a part in the accomplishment nor do I explicitly benefit in any way, shape or form.
For that matter, I feel a similar joy when I see ANY human being accomplish a difficult task on their own, whether they are my children or related to me or not.
That's my one example to infer that joy != selfishness, and logic requires only one such example to reject the premise.
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not for the benefit of anyone else;
Have you never witnessed a sailing coach teaching a child to sail? Or a charter captain bringing the joy of a unique sailing vacation to a couple that could not directly enjoy that mode of travel on their own? These people may well enjoy what they are doing, but it ALSO benefits others. And through gainful employment, they provide for their families and meet responsibilities. By their clients getting recreation and something fulfilling in THEIR lives, even for a short time like a vacation, they can better provide for THEIR families or grow into responsible adults, etc.
It's kinda like, you know, a connected web...a whole of social benefit, if you will.
I can think of MANY examples where the act of one sailor directly benefits others. Indirect benefits, such as the Leukemia Society's "Sail America" program and "Ocean Watch," also can be listed. I am sure we are hoping to include this Triton RTW effort to fit this category.
Quote
although we may try to justify it otherwise.
Just because someone enjoys what they do, that does NOT make it in itself selfish. At least I don't believe it does. My angry man, the sailing coach, the ocean watch crew are a few examples. I personally don't think they are exceptions, but your opinion may differ. I don't for a second believe that just because something is recreation it is equated with selfish.
There ARE selfish sailors ... no doubt. I am not sure which group is the exception.
Quote
Now, is doing something selfishly for ones own benefit wrong, evil, or otherwise undesirable?
Yes. Selfishness is evil in my opinion. As I said before, I define this as a balanced whole of one's life, though, not necessarily as the individual actions. Engaging in a recreational activity that gives one enjoyment is not selfish; pursuing it to the exclusion of family obligations or spending money you don't have (ie, credit debt) to do it might be, to use a couple of examples.
I know selfish people...I am related to some. It's not a character trait I care to accept or make excuses for.
It seems you and I have different life philosophies on this subject. That's fine. I think I've stated my side as clearly as I can, so I won't need to belabor the points further.
Quote from: tomwatt on August 04, 2011, 07:54:37 AM
Wonder how he manages to cook/eat? Short of burning anything that floats by, I'd guess that if he managed to stock enough food and water aboard, he'd start running into fuel storage issues next. Unless he's stocking pre-packaged ready-to-eat meals that need no water or cooking. But even a 6 month's supply of MREs is going to overflow the vee-berth and beyond.
He plans on taking a years supply of dehydrated meals that will need only boiling water to cook. The mre,s would be cruel and unusual punishment beside being against regs to eat that many in a row. The trash would overflow the boat. Unbelievable how much trash one of those things can generate.
for water he will have a water maker and catch rain water, did not mention fuel.
Sadly MRB, MRE's consumption period got extended, so they can feed you for a long, long time on them. But yes, they and their civilian counterparts generate considerable amount of waste wrappings, etc.
:P
I realize kerosene/diesel/jp8 provide a lot of bang for the buck, but since I'm brain-dead about math, how would one calculate a year's supply of cook-time? Can he really carry that much juice aboard... and does that leave any margin to spare (becalmed, etc.)?
My wife and I just finished over 3 months of cruising. We cooked on a homemade sterno stove, using a small pressure cooker. We used 36 cans of sterno, or about 12 a month. A 72 can box of sterno is about 1 cubic foot. It can't spill, and is safer than liquid fuel. The gimballed stove and covered pressure cooker made cooking at sea in bad weather possible.
Eating freeze dried and dehydrated food gets old after a while, but it is certainly possible to store enough of it in a Triton to last 1 year.
I'm hoping he makes it.
Quote from: tomwatt on August 05, 2011, 06:23:30 AM
how would one calculate a year's supply of cook-time? Can he really carry that much juice aboard... and does that leave any margin to spare (becalmed, etc.)?
Two points.
The first is that the answer will have to come from his trials, and is why you DO trials before starting a trip like this (unlike some people's approach). For example, I know that our 10 lb bottle of propane lasts about 3 months with consistent use. To go a year, we'd need to plan based on that number (or about 40 lbs).
The next point is margin for error. In planning for a year, he's already built in 2 months of margin, since he thinks the trip will really take about 10 months. Likewise, my 40 lb number above has some margin built into it already, since that's 3 months of CONSISTENT use. We can lower our consumption by altering "consistent."
With these two built-in margins, there would be no excuse to run out of fuel. But, I maintain you cannot know this from armchair planning or Internet forum reading. You have to do it, with YOUR cooking style and the meals YOU cook, and how hot YOU want water for dishes, coffee, etc, etc etc. It matters.
There's no substitute for trials and experiment.
My two cents...
I feel he has a chance to make it. Water will be a concern, I consumed about 1/2 Gal. per day. Pills can help with vitamin C etc. I relied upon canned juices, a lot of space for 1 year. My chief concern is that to keep his schedule he will put tremendous strains on his gear, as speed increases the loads grow exponentionly. Being a prudent sailor, he will have a bailout plan for every leg of his voyage. There is no disgrace in stopping. I wish him the best. Phil
Quote from: okawbow on August 05, 2011, 08:21:59 AM
My wife and I just finished over 3 months of cruising. We cooked on a homemade sterno stove, using a small pressure cooker. We used 36 cans of sterno, or about 12 a month. A 72 can box of sterno is about 1 cubic foot. It can't spill, and is safer than liquid fuel. The gimballed stove and covered pressure cooker made cooking at sea in bad weather possible.
Eating freeze dried and dehydrated food gets old after a while, but it is certainly possible to store enough of it in a Triton to last 1 year.
I'm hoping he makes it.
Our '2nd burner' stove is a sterno sea swing. I love it.... but apparently you and I(and Rose) are the only people in the known universe who are willing to cook on the 'cool' flame of Sterno.
Quote from: Captain Smollett on August 04, 2011, 08:45:28 PM
Quote from: Godot on August 04, 2011, 05:09:06 PM
Perhaps a person COULD sail for his livelihood,
A person COULD? Might that be taken as a bit insulting? I know of 1000's of sailing coaches, harbor tour guides, tall ship cruise ship crews and small crewed charter captains that make their living on the water. There are also still sailing fishermen in other parts of the world.
Man, I sure didn't mean to get you all riled up. I sure didn't mean to insult anyone. I think you are taking my comments a little too seriously. The truth is the vast majority of us participate in sailing for no other reason than we enjoy it. I don't think that can seriously be disputed. Someone, somewhere, is making money doing everything under the sun. heck, drug users are providing steady employment for the illegal drug trade (I know, an extreme example; although less extreme than my first thought).
I think maybe we also have a different feel for the word selfish. I don't see it necessarily as a negative. I strongly suspect that if we all just did what it took to make ourselves happy, and darn the torpedoes, the world would be a better place. I'm not talking of shirking responsibilities. Just the opposite. I'm talking of taking responsibility for our own happiness. This viewpoint probably comes directly from my failed marriage where I spent very little time on myself and was generally pretty miserable. Call it healthy and necessary selfishness.
And with that, I am almost done except to say that in our first world society, sailing is not terribly practical as transportation because speed often matters (sorry boss, the wind was contrary...I'll be a couple days late), and for the majority of us, where we have to go is not exactly seaside. If you, or others, have managed your lifestyle where it is practical, then good for you. For most people that I know, though, it is clearly not practical. I think a serious societal reorganization would be required to change that. Given the changes that the world is going through, though, you never know...
Quote from: Captain Smollett on August 05, 2011, 09:51:14 AM
Two points.
The first is that the answer will have to come from his trials, and is why you DO trials before starting a trip like this (unlike some people's approach). For example, I know that our 10 lb bottle of propane lasts about 3 months with consistent use. To go a year, we'd need to plan based on that number (or about 40 lbs).
The next point is margin for error. In planning for a year, he's already built in 2 months of margin, since he thinks the trip will really take about 10 months. Likewise, my 40 lb number above has some margin built into it already, since that's 3 months of CONSISTENT use. We can lower our consumption by altering "consistent."
With these two built-in margins, there would be no excuse to run out of fuel. But, I maintain you cannot know this from armchair planning or Internet forum reading. You have to do it, with YOUR cooking style and the meals YOU cook, and how hot YOU want water for dishes, coffee, etc, etc etc. It matters.
There's no substitute for trials and experiment.
My two cents...
All great points. I guess the reason I questioned his fuel capacity was 'cause I closed my eyes and thought about my own tendency to want to enjoy coffee, along with all the hot water heating that entails over and above the routine cooking and just saw a need for a huge fuel supply. It didn't occur to me at all that my boots wouldn't fit his feet.
Thanks, tom
He says he started sailing about a year and a half ago and has done some off shore racing. His venture is a little more than two years away so I suppose it's doable. I can see the excitement in doing something like this but as for me...no. For one thing I'm too old but that aside, it's would be just too boring and stressful in a boat that size.
I might donate to the cause (I just love tits ::)) but won't do it for another year or so. I just to see if he is still around or not. What you guys do is up to you of course.
Fair winds,
Pappy Jack
In regard to "why" different people sail...
Some people get it (http://bbs.trailersailor.com/forums/trailersailor/index.cgi/read/800909) ;D
And some people don't. ::)
Posted by CapnK, but written by Thomas, the sailor in question, cap'n of The Pink Boat. :)
Thomas - if you want to cut-n-paste this into your own reply, feel free, and I will then delete this post...And I'd also like to say that I appreciate Thomas' attitude in what he has written below, despite the what could be considered perhaps 'adversarial nature' of some of what has been posted in this thread so far. :)
OK, here is Thomas' answer:
QuoteWow, what a great thread. I really appreciate all the feedback in here. As some as you noticed, this is a new site and I wrote it all myself so you unfortunately struggled through a few of my mistakes. Turns out IE8 on XP didn?t send a correct header so my GZIP compression code was failing. More importantly, my about me page is lame. Turns out, its really hard to write an about me page and I am busier than heck prepping my boat, putting it back together for races, working my full time job and running this non-profit so some things take a back seat. As far as technology wars go, I prefer not to discuss religion . But again, I apologize for the coding error on my part, I am kinda busy with this whole thing so massive regressions tests aren?t the highest order priority?. Enough about stuff that doesn?t matter.
Before the flaming begins, I am not a writer so please excuse any mistakes.
A lot of people are very cynical of my trip. I get bombarded all the time with Why Breast Cancer, Why so publicly, why not lung cancer, and I will add, why speed record, why start before the trip, how will you take enough supplies, sailing experience, boat prep, where does the money go?
Experience? Prep? I started sailing about 2 years ago. I appear to be darn good at and I really love doing it. It?s the only thing I do. I have double handed from Hawaii to San Francisco and have done a 400 mile solo race on Darwind in a gale. (You can read about that on the site if you want) I have sailed about 6000 miles. I plan on completing the Single Handed Transpac and return single handed from Hawaii adding another 5000+ single handed miles. I race single handed in the OYRA and am currently in 2nd place by two points (with a triton). I have rebuilt her from the ground up, new rudder, transducers, mast, boom, rigging, outboard chainplates, wind, solar, winches, lines, windvance, autopilot, SSB, electronics, removed the atomic 4 and replaces with 6 volt battery bank, cockpit lockers, on and on and on. I have turned every bolt myself and make every connection. I ?could? leave today except for the watermakers and I have creature features I want to finish on the inside first. I can navigate by sextant and I am learning self-administered first-aid.
How will I take enough food? Someone was right, only one way possible, dehydrated foods. I will have two PUR 40e watermakers with rebuild kits and an all else fails 20 gallon tank of water. My sea trials have shown that I can live on 4 meals a day (more than I need) and the 1400 meals and fuel required to cook them only weight about 700lbs and can easily be stowed on the boat. Remember, I have no engine or fuel, so that frees up a ton of space. I cook exclusively with my JetBoil and yeah, it sucks, but it?s the only way to make this happen. I will bring other things and catch fish (hopefully) but I certainly am not going to depend on that. Failure is not an option.
Speed Record in a Triton are you nuts? Yup, I am. 5kts avg VMG gets me around in 8 months. My boat easily does 6 and during the 2011 longpac a had a 145 mile day with 30kts of breeze on a beam reach. I expect the conditions to be similar and I should be able to finish quickly and why shouldn?t I try for that? If I can average just over 4kts I will snatch the record. Heck yes I am going for it!
Why Breast Cancer? It affects us all. 1 in 8 women will have to fight this disease. It?s affected my family and am fortunate to still have survivors with me. A lot of people I love are not so fortunate. Sailing is the thing I do best and by painting my tiny boat pink and attempting to do something that hasn?t been done, I can make the greatest difference. I think someone in this thread mentioned that it appears I ?went looking? for a cause. Well, what if I did? Is that so bad? When I am done, I will have raised 1 million for the BCRF and that is more than I could ever personally open my wallet for? Does it matter what order this crazy idea of mine came in? Whoever noticed that is right. When I first decided to sail around the world it wasn?t to save the ta-tas but I soon realized the potential power of doing just that. I am not sure if anyone has tried to run a non-profit reading this, but I can assure you, it?s a massive undertaking. I am proud to be doing this trip for them and the BCRF could not be more excited to have me as a partner.
Why so publicly, why so soon? Curing cancer is only a matter or resources. There is a cure for not only for breast cancer but all forms and if we could spend the defense budget for 10 years on cancer research we would have a cure. There is a critical mass of funding needed to cure cancer. Would anyone here be talking about me if I painted my boat orange and did this trip? Does anyone even know what color orange is associated with? Its MS and most people don?t know that. My friend who works for the MS society and has done all the graphic work for the site gets it. Its loud! I have one shot to do the most amount of good and this hands down in the best way I could do it. Lung cancer kills way more people but I would not be able to make as big a contribution if American Lung Cancer Society was the beneficiary of the trip. I sincerely hope that the million dollars in research I raise leads not only to the prevention and cure of breast cancer, but all forms. Someone had it perfectly right, raising 1 million dollars is no easy task and it takes time and effort. I am starting now, with a very public approach to raise as much awareness as I possibly can and do the most amount of good. Some people don?t think I have enough experience to be successful. I beg to differ. I think I could have more sure, but really, I am strong, healthy and have the desire. I am surrounded by ?dreamers? and ?tinkerers? who never leave the dock. Now is the time while I still can. What I don?t know, I will figure out.
Finally, where does the money go? I should have started with this one, it?s the easiest answer. AT LEAST 80cents of every dollar goes to the BCRF. The rest goes back to The Pink Boat to fund the operating costs of the pink boat inc and a few cents goes to buy equipment that will insure the success of the trip. Someone asked why not just give to the BCRF directly? If you don?t think what I am doing is worthwhile then donate directly to them! That is great! I have done my part and raising awareness and someone who might not have donated did. But, I personally feel that if you think what I am doing is worthwhile, then your donation goes further with The Pink Boat because specifically its publicity. The more the Pink Boat is supported, the more we can do. As of today, we just started The Pink Boat Regatta to be held October 23rd 2011 in the SF Bay and it will be hosted by the Corinthian Yacht Club. It takes money to host an event and its impossible to get all of the costs associated with an event like this donated. This is why donating to the Pink Boat actually makes your donation go further.
I really appreciate all encouragement and critical thinking about my voyage and mission and I hope to see you on the water someday. Please feel free to call my cell phone or email if you want to talk more. If you have suggestions on how I could do things better, I would love to hear them.
-Thomas
Wow, what a great thread. I really appreciate all the feedback in here. As some as you noticed, this is a new site and I wrote it all myself so you unfortunately struggled through a few of my mistakes. Turns out IE8 on XP didn?t send a correct header so my GZIP compression code was failing. More importantly, my about me page is lame. Turns out, its really hard to write an about me page and I am busier than heck prepping my boat, putting it back together for races, working my full time job and running this non-profit so some things take a back seat. As far as technology wars go, I prefer not to discuss religion . But again, I apologize for the coding error on my part, I am kinda busy with this whole thing so massive regressions tests aren?t the highest order priority?. Enough about stuff that doesn?t matter.
Before the flaming begins, I am not a writer so please excuse any mistakes.
A lot of people are very cynical of my trip. I get bombarded all the time with Why Breast Cancer, Why so publicly, why not lung cancer, and I will add, why speed record, why start before the trip, how will you take enough supplies, sailing experience, boat prep, where does the money go?
Experience? Prep? I started sailing about 2 years ago. I appear to be darn good at and I really love doing it. It?s the only thing I do. I have double handed from Hawaii to San Francisco and have done a 400 mile solo race on Darwind in a gale. (You can read about that on the site if you want) I have sailed about 6000 miles. I plan on completing the Single Handed Transpac and return single handed from Hawaii adding another 5000+ single handed miles. I race single handed in the OYRA and am currently in 2nd place by two points (with a triton). I have rebuilt her from the ground up, new rudder, transducers, mast, boom, rigging, outboard chainplates, wind, solar, winches, lines, windvance, autopilot, SSB, electronics, removed the atomic 4 and replaces with 6 volt battery bank, cockpit lockers, on and on and on. I have turned every bolt myself and make every connection. I ?could? leave today except for the watermakers and I have creature features I want to finish on the inside first. I can navigate by sextant and I am learning self-administered first-aid.
How will I take enough food? Someone was right, only one way possible, dehydrated foods. I will have two PUR 40e watermakers with rebuild kits and an all else fails 20 gallon tank of water. My sea trials have shown that I can live on 4 meals a day (more than I need) and the 1400 meals and fuel required to cook them only weight about 700lbs and can easily be stowed on the boat. Remember, I have no engine or fuel, so that frees up a ton of space. I cook exclusively with my JetBoil and yeah, it sucks, but it?s the only way to make this happen. I will bring other things and catch fish (hopefully) but I certainly am not going to depend on that. Failure is not an option.
Speed Record in a Triton are you nuts? Yup, I am. 5kts avg VMG gets me around in 8 months. My boat easily does 6 and during the 2011 longpac a had a 145 mile day with 30kts of breeze on a beam reach. I expect the conditions to be similar and I should be able to finish quickly and why shouldn?t I try for that? If I can average just over 4kts I will snatch the record. Heck yes I am going for it!
Why Breast Cancer? It affects us all. 1 in 8 women will have to fight this disease. It?s affected my family and am fortunate to still have survivors with me. A lot of people I love are not so fortunate. Sailing is the thing I do best and by painting my tiny boat pink and attempting to do something that hasn?t been done, I can make the greatest difference. I think someone in this thread mentioned that it appears I ?went looking? for a cause. Well, what if I did? Is that so bad? When I am done, I will have raised 1 million for the BCRF and that is more than I could ever personally open my wallet for? Does it matter what order this crazy idea of mine came in? Whoever noticed that is right. When I first decided to sail around the world it wasn?t to save the ta-tas but I soon realized the potential power of doing just that. I am not sure if anyone has tried to run a non-profit reading this, but I can assure you, it?s a massive undertaking. I am proud to be doing this trip for them and the BCRF could not be more excited to have me as a partner.
Why so publicly, why so soon? Curing cancer is only a matter or resources. There is a cure for not only for breast cancer but all forms and if we could spend the defense budget for 10 years on cancer research we would have a cure. There is a critical mass of funding needed to cure cancer. Would anyone here be talking about me if I painted my boat orange and did this trip? Does anyone even know what color orange is associated with? Its MS and most people don?t know that. My friend who works for the MS society and has done all the graphic work for the site gets it. Its loud! I have one shot to do the most amount of good and this hands down in the best way I could do it. Lung cancer kills way more people but I would not be able to make as big a contribution if American Lung Cancer Society was the beneficiary of the trip. I sincerely hope that the million dollars in research I raise leads not only to the prevention and cure of breast cancer, but all forms. Someone had it perfectly right, raising 1 million dollars is no easy task and it takes time and effort. I am starting now, with a very public approach to raise as much awareness as I possibly can and do the most amount of good. Some people don?t think I have enough experience to be successful. I beg to differ. I think I could have more sure, but really, I am strong, healthy and have the desire. I am surrounded by ?dreamers? and ?tinkerers? who never leave the dock. Now is the time while I still can. What I don?t know, I will figure out.
Finally, where does the money go? I should have started with this one, it?s the easiest answer. AT LEAST 80cents of every dollar goes to the BCRF. The rest goes back to The Pink Boat to fund the operating costs of the pink boat inc and a few cents goes to buy equipment that will insure the success of the trip. Someone asked why not just give to the BCRF directly? If you don?t think what I am doing is worthwhile then donate directly to them! That is great! I have done my part and raising awareness and someone who might not have donated did. But, I personally feel that if you think what I am doing is worthwhile, then your donation goes further with The Pink Boat because specifically its publicity. The more the Pink Boat is supported, the more we can do. As of today, we just started The Pink Boat Regatta to be held October 23rd 2011 in the SF Bay and it will be hosted by the Corinthian Yacht Club. It takes money to host an event and its impossible to get all of the costs associated with an event like this donated. This is why donating to the Pink Boat actually makes your donation go further.
I really appreciate all encouragement and critical thinking about my voyage and mission and I hope to see you on the water someday. Please feel free to call my cell phone or email if you want to talk more. If you have suggestions on how I could do things better, I would love to hear them.
-Thomas
616-485-3984, MrPink@ThePinkBoat.org
Just thought I would give you guys an update. The boat is being painted pink right now by KKMI and the first Pink Boat Regatta is being held by the Corinthian Yacht Club Oct 23rd if you are in the Bay area, it would be great to see you on the course!
Okay, okay already ;) I've donated. Not as much as I would like for reasons too complex to mention.
I have a wife, a daughter and two granddaughters. Need I say more?
Good luck to you,
Pappy Jack
P.S. Here's a grog for ya for what you are doing.
P.P.S. Please keep us up dated...and send pic's.
Hey Pappy, Thank you so much for donating! I just thought you guys would all like to know we collected 11,000 in net donations for the regatta. We were able to keep regatta expenses to about 1600 resulting in a net donation of 9500. We exceeded our commitment to donate 80% of our donations and donated 7700 to the Breast Cancer Research Foundation and retained 1800 for future events and expenses. You can check out the full race report on our site and several others. http://www.ThePinkBoat.org/Media.aspx has links to Latitude 38, The SF Chronicle and NorCal Sailing.
Next year I am racing to Hawaii Singlehanded and when I return, will be making Landfall in Seattle where we will be hosting another Pink Boat Regatta. After this its back to SF and then to San Diego for the final regatta of the year.
In boat news, I am currently replacing my broken mast beam, re-bedding the stanchions and jib car tracks, working on standing wave problem on the 4band of my SSB (PS, dont test your SSB while your shore side battery charger is running, I burned mine up...), and re-epoxying the Cape Horn wind vane thru transom tube (it broke lose I am guessing because I didnt rough up the stainless enough). All of this before the 10th of November as I am taking off for San Diego to attend the America's Cup World Series.
If any of you are going to be in San Diego, please hook up with me. My boat will be at the San Diego Yacht Club from the 15th through the 2nd of December.
If you live in Seattle, I just joined the Sloop Tavern Yacht Club and I am looking forward to having some beers up there very soon.
Also, a lot of people raised questions about not supporting me until I get closer to leaving. That was great feedback and we have one better for you, you can pledge your support and you don't have to donate until I successfully come back so you can rest assured this is for real. http://www.ThePinkBoat.org/Pledge.
Thanks again for all of your support and I hope to see you on the water!
-Thomas
Just to bring people up to date,here's a video of his boat being painted...PINK!!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ub6kLrOlmMw&feature=related . A good cause but pink? ::)
Fair winds,
Pappy Jack
Just checking in with you guys! We finally got a video together. If you want to help, you can share this! http://www.thepinkboat.org/videos/PinkBoatProject.aspx
This voyage looks delayed at best, dead in the water more likely. Skippers name is Thomas and I know him reasonably well. He just got married a few weeks ago. He eventually painted his boat pink, really, really pink. (I have a bright pink kayak so I shall remain opinion less on this decision.)
thepinkboat.org is no longer, been down for a week or longer. this saddens and upsets me. Sadden because it was a good cause that looked to be picking up steam, Mad because alot of people donated money and bought hats/shirts whatever in support of this journey. If the money made it to the proper channels fine if not and the guy used the money to solo sail all over the pacific and then just give in, well that just plain sucks. Either way I think everyone deserves to atleast here the current state of affairs. Seems fishy its all of a sudden just gone!
I doubt it is fishy at all. I suspect this is just another case of biting off more than he could chew. Happens all the time. Heck, happened to many of us while working toward the Scoot. This is kind of why I don't donate to these kinds of things until they get well established. <shrug> There is always a risk.
I just hate to see a dream die.
I dunno if he has abandoned the idea or simply delayed (although I think still inside his 2 year timescale for departure) - could even be onloy some more website problems (see page 1 and his subsequent comments)...................but "life" has a habit of intervening in even the best of intentions.