Where are the younger folks?

[Frank]

I'm currently at Port Charlotte boat storage after helping haul out a boat and prepping it to store.
First...I must say, what an awesome boat yard! Clean, well run, nice community room with TV, fridge, cookers, showers and get this ...free ice!
Top that off with a great boating community and if it were on the E coast I think I'd be switching yards!
Anyhoot...walking around the yard and chatting in the community center it dawned on me that at 61, I'm one of the younger folks here! Have only met 2 boats with younger crew than I.
Which Leeds me to wonder.....
where are the younger crowd?
Is there a younger crowd?
The boat yard demographics have certainly changed since I started at this.
Sure hope that sense of adventure isn't totally lost to chasing the "American Dream"....

Edit to note that the 2 "younger boats" are folks around 50....

[Norman]

My 50's son and his wife are on a bare boat charter out of Tahiti for the next two weeks with two other couples.

He has sailed a bit on my Aquafin sailboard, my Neptune 16, and just last year, on my Mac 22.  He does not sail much, but both of the other couples are sailors, so they should do well, and have loads of fun.

He is currently oriented toward trailer travel, and has a diesel pickup to pull with, so any sailing will be charters with friends who also sail.

His mid 20's son has the scout sailing merit badge, and has sailed with me on the Aquafinn and Mac.  Sailing is not the focus as he gets started in his career as an engineer.

At 23 years your senior, I am debating selling the Mac and retiring from active sailing.  A trailer mounted boat is too much hassle to launch, and a $4000 dollar wet slip is more than makes sense for as seldom as I would get out.  I like company more now than a decade ago.  Part of the change is the increasing possibility that a man overboard will occur, and it is comforting to have some one competent on board.  Such people are surprisingly hard to find.

Not surprising, the  modestly younger people in my Marina also prefer younger crew when they go out.  10 or 20 years ago, I had a choice of boats on cruising races, and especially being the only crew with the owner sailing from the home Marina to the starting point of the race.  The owner that I raced with the last 5 years died, and the other owners of boats competing racers are not interested in a crew member who does not go on the foredeck under way, even if I go ashore for the actual race.  Years ago, I solo sailed to the race start and picked up the owner and crew.

A real puzzle has been two sailors who down sized to WWP 15's, which they solo sailed until they decided they were too old, and sold their boats.  I invited each them to sail with me on the Mac.  Both turned me down, each with their own version of "When I decided I was too old to sail, I quit sailing".  Both of them seem to be unwilling to be second fiddle, so to speak.  I had sailed on the Potter with one of them, and he was probably right in his decline, as he quit when he was frail enough that getting in the Potter from a floating dock even with his gunwale was risky.  My Mac would have been much more difficult.

That is the view from here, young fellow!

Norman

[Frank]

Norm...
I understand the aging thing and getting out. A friend Roy over at Green Turtle has mobility issues as well as other health issues. His time boating is extremely limited....he is only 71.
I was totally blessed to run into Ken and Joanne at this boatyard. We lost contact several years ago but befriended from 04-07 at boat yard yards back then. They both look awesome! Totally mobile and flexible....Ken is 81 shortly.
My knees are both shot, back goes out, right shoulder is toast... My fore deck acrobatics arent what they used to be, but I'm a ways from quitting...
So...the aging thing I understand...
The lack of youth...or not even youth....55 and UNDER.... I don't understand.
Seems the romance of boating....the call of adventure ...just isnt what it used to be.....sadly

[CharlieJ]

well, we had a couple who used to post here. Now on their third liveaboard, this one a Westsail 32 ,and now in Boston I believe.

Both under 35, so they ARE out there

Talking about Woody and Raylay of course :)

[lance on cloud nine]

you would think with all the hype of "tiny house living" that the young share all over the web, that they would be ALL ABOUT an inexpensive self contained small cruising boat. I have been rehabbing an O'Day 26 for a Florida winter hide out (my wife and I live in Indiana). there is a small river in the center of our town, mostly too shallow to sail, but a few deep holes here and there. I think I may float my finished boat in the river, and live on it a month this Summer, just to show whats possible.

[Frank]

Good point!
Much cheaper than building a tiny house!

[Bubba the Pirate]

I think culture and technology changes are making a difference. If you look on Youtube there are a bunch of younger and youngish sailors. Now, some are just posers and I can't stand to watch but there are some real sailors too.

I've seen several boats with younger crews than me here at Riverside. In fact, the Sailing Uma crew (a youtube channel) did a major refit here a couple years ago. I saw them when I came thru on a delivery before I bought Emma.

[lastgreatgeneration]

Departing fall 2019 for the Bahamas for a shakedown. Maybe traveling further on I might come back not sure yet. 32yo working as I go.

[w00dy]

Still here CJ! Just working too much ;)

I agree with Bubba about changes in popular technology and culture. I'm going to be late for work this morning if I keep writing, but will try to follow up soon.

[CharlieJ]

Hey Woody.Was just thinking about you and Ralay yesterday, wondering how you were.. Hadn't gotten any word from her in weeks

[w00dy]

My guess is that the vast majority of younger folks are just too busy trying to make ends meet to spend much time on a "luxury" like pleasure boating. Granted, there are some oddballs like Raylay and myself that have been both lucky and made choices that allowed us the flexibility to go cruising during our "younger years, but we're probably the exception.

Many young folks are facing a rapidly evolving economy, wage stagnation, and a limit to upward mobility. The boom of production boats in the US coincided with a middle class that had both time and money to spare. Our generation is busy trying to figure out how to pay rent and afford health insurance. It's no suprise that many folks out cruising, long or short term, are people that have spent a long time working up to it and a certain level of financial stability.

On another cultural level, I wonder if younger generations are more urban-centric and less likely to have been exposed to the kinds of outdoor activities that I take for granted in my life. I feel pretty lucky to have grown up in a rural area where I could run around outside, go camping, canoeing, sailing, etc. On the other hand, I do think there is a higher prevalence of youth programs like the ASA courses, youth sailing camps, schools that teach younger groups how to sail at a young age. This is still a very select group of young people though, and many of them go on to professional lives that don't revolve around long term cruising.

As far as the internet goes, there is more sailing related media and discussion than ever. Unfortunately, it seems to have shifted away from the traditional "forums" like we use here, and onto the big social media platforms like Facebook, YouTube and Reddit. I have mixed feelings about this. I like that more people are engaged, there's more information, and it's easier to connect. However I feel like it's too easy for the KISS message and others to get lost in all that main stream info. Not sure what the best way to get more young people integrated and interested in SailFar would be. I'm sure Capt. K has given this plenty of thought already. Maybe just simple word of mouth and organic growth is enough? Maybe we could reach out and engage with other popular online sailing communities? ??

SailFar is still my favorite sailing forum. BoatDesign.net is another awesome community as well.

[Phantom Jim]

It may be  " they know the price of everything and the value of nothing"

[w00dy]

Kind of harsh, Jim, don't you think? Reminds me of that old Socrates quote:

"The children now love luxury. They have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise."

I'd rather not turn this into a generational argument, but it seems that many younger people have come to grips with the fact that we simply can't continue to exist as our parents and grandparents did. Our planet and society can't sustain the resource intensive lifestyles that my grandparents generation took for granted.

If anything, I think younger generations would be more likely to connect with the "Sailfar" mentality. These days, austerity seems to be in vogue. My guess is that as more people in our society grow accustomed to having to tighten the belt, they'll be willing to "settle" for more realistic and manageable hobbies and dreams. It's only natural to justify that by choosing to identify yourself accordingly, with the "new normal".

As far as this forum is concerned though, I think an attitude of encouraging inclusion is important, if you don't want to run the young folks off....Even if they are ne'r do well's like me ;)

[Norman]

"The children now love luxury. They have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise."

Well selected quote, wOOdy, and you are correct that the attitudes of many of the recent generations are very different than some who have gone before.  On the other hand, I have always thought that the quote has been "enhanced" in the translation :).

Today, I was at the marina to scrub the winters accumulation of dirt and moss off, and had time to observe the sailing school/summer camp operation that exists every year.  it is very competently run by the same lady every year, and she has a young and skilled staff.  The age seems to start at somewhere close to 6, and they are sailing Sunfish the second day (today).  By the end of the week, they are quite skilled, and sail as 2 person teams, no instructor on board.  There is an instructor nearby in a small power boat, just in case.

Older kids learn to sail flying Scotts, and then Hobie Cats.  The older students reach well into the teens.

I have sailed my boat out of the marina through the whole fleet, on Friday, and finding my way through 40 or more student sailors is an adventure, as the sailable channel at low tide is about 75 yards wide.  At that age, most of the younger ones are concentrating on keeping the sunfish going.  The more advanced and older students are much more aware of traffic, but I do not always guess which I am approaching.  Further out, in the Potomac River, are the Flying Scotts and Hobies, and they are easy to stay clear of.

Here, there are plenty of new additions to the sailing community, and the local colleges have top sailing teams, Georgetown is one of the best in the country

The Tuesday night "Beer can" racing, though, is dominated by owners and crew in their 30's and up, with emphasis on up.  I was at the picnic following the Geico Cup Saturday, and there were less than 10% under 30 there.  Finding a partner and starting a family seems to move to the top of the priorities, and then children completely change the focus, but the children go to sailing camp as they reach school age.

There is not much actual cruising done here, although there are over 70 suitable boats in slips, and another 30 on trailers, as mine is.

Basically, around here, sailing is happening, but not cruising, and definitely not living aboard cruising, unless CJ is passing through.

Norman

[Phantom Jim]

Harsh?  It was not intended to be, since arrogance, ignorance and lack of common sense is not a trait solely attributed to the young ;)  With all the interest in tiny homes and simplification, one would think there would be a lot of interest in smaller boats.  Us older folk seem to be interested in the biggest and most complicated boats we can pay for.

George Bernard Shaw (?) once said that youth is wasted on the young.

[w00dy]

Norm- There are quite a few public and private sailing clubs in the area here, and there is often a race course set up in the middle of the harbor (also the main shipping channel). Add to that a city full of of both competent and not so much (weekend warrior) boaters and all the commercial traffic (very busy with ferries and the occasional large ship, and it gets downright hectic sometimes! Adventure indeed!

Somehow everyone seems to avoid crashing into one another but every once and a while a novice group in a rental boat manages to drift out in front of large vessel traffic. There's nothing like a loaded LNG tanker bearing down on you, blasting 5 whistles, to wake you up and make you pay attention.

Jim - I hear ya on the bigger, more complicated part. I yearn for the luxuries sometimes, and even though I guess I'm relatively young, there are plenty of times I have thought to myself, "I'm getting too old for this..."  ::)

Sometimes I get to thinking our boat is too big and too complicated, but then I remember that most people also have a house which they live on and a place to keep all their worldly possessions. After living aboard with another person for most of the last 10 years, my boat feels quite small sometimes.  Offshore, she feels even smaller! If you asked a merchant mariner the size that constitutes a "small boat", I wonder where they would draw the line?

[Gene]

50 here, wife is 47 ... but we both have birthdays next month. I expect/hope to be 53 when we cut the dock lines.

[CapnK]

Gene, I have you by a year, almost 2. I guess that makes us youngsters near enough, at least when compared to these old geezers here. ;D